Circle of Greats 1894 Balloting

This post is for voting and discussion in the 97th round of balloting for the Circle of Greats (COG).  This round adds to the list of candidates eligible to receive your votes those players born in 1894. Rules and lists are after the jump.

The new group of 1894-born players, in order to join the eligible list, must, as usual, have played at least 10 seasons in the major leagues or generated at least 20 Wins Above Replacement (“WAR”, as calculated by baseball-reference.com, and for this purpose meaning 20 total WAR for everyday players and 20 pitching WAR for pitchers). This new group of 1894-born candidates joins the eligible holdovers from previous rounds to comprise the full list of players eligible to appear on your ballots.

Each submitted ballot, if it is to be counted, must include three and only three eligible players.  As always, the one player who appears on the most ballots cast in the round is inducted into the Circle of Greats.  Players who fail to win induction but appear on half or more of the ballots that are cast win four added future rounds of ballot eligibility.  Players who appear on 25% or more of the ballots cast, but less than 50%, earn two added future rounds of ballot eligibility.  Any other player in the top 9 (including ties) in ballot appearances, or who appears on at least 10% of the ballots, wins one additional round of ballot eligibility.

All voting for this round closes at 11:59 PM EDT Thursday, June 18th, while changes to previously cast ballots are allowed until 11:59 PM EDT Tuesday, June 16th.

If you’d like to follow the vote tally, and/or check to make sure I’ve recorded your vote correctly, you can see my ballot-counting spreadsheet for this round here: COG 1894 Vote Tally. I’ll be updating the spreadsheet periodically with the latest votes. Initially, there is a row in the spreadsheet for every voter who has cast a ballot in any of the past rounds, but new voters are entirely welcome — new voters will be added to the spreadsheet as their ballots are submitted.  Also initially, there is a column for each of the holdover candidates; additional player columns from the new born-in-1894 group will be added to the spreadsheet as votes are cast for them.

Choose your three players from the lists below of eligible players.  The fourteen current holdovers are listed in order of the number of future rounds (including this one) through which they are assured eligibility, and alphabetically when the future eligibility number is the same.  The 1894 birth-year players are listed below in order of the number of seasons each played in the majors, and alphabetically among players with the same number of seasons played.

Holdovers:
Harmon Killebrew (eligibility guaranteed for 9 rounds)
Roy Campanella  (eligibility guaranteed for 3 rounds)
Goose Goslin (eligibility guaranteed for 2 rounds)
Hoyt Wilhelm (eligibility guaranteed for 2 rounds)
Richie Ashburn (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Kevin Brown (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Dennis Eckersley (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Dwight Evans (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Gabby Hartnett (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Ted Lyons (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Graig Nettles (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Rick Reuschel (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Luis Tiant (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)
Dave Winfield (eligibility guaranteed for this round only)

Everyday Players (born in 1894, ten or more seasons played in the major leagues or at least 20 WAR):
Joe Judge
Rube Bressler
Harry Heilmann
Bing Miller
Frank Snyder
Sparky Adams
Bill Wambsganss
Hank DeBerry
Butch Henline
Larry Woodall

Pitchers (born in 1894, ten or more seasons played in the major leagues or at least 20 WAR):
Herb Pennock
Howard Ehmke
Lee Meadows
Ray Kolp
Al Mamaux

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Bryan O'Connor
Editor
8 years ago

Most Wins Above Average, excluding negative seasonal totals:

Brown 43.3
Reuschel 40.6
Heilmann 40.3
Tiant 37.5
Lyons 36.7
Nettles 35.7
Evans 34.9
Eckersley 34.3
Ashburn 33.9
Killebrew 33.0
Goslin 31.7
Winfield 31.1
Hartnett 30.3
Wilhelm 28.7
Pennock 21.3
Campanella 19.2

Brown, Eckersley, Campanella

I see Heilmann benefitting from the new-guy bonus and sailing in here. He’s probably deserving, but I think we’re more capable of comparing him objectively to the other candidates if he waits a round.

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago
Reply to  Bryan O'Connor

In retrospect, it would have been nice if everybody had to “wait a round”, regardless of their support.

This project is as much about the discussion as it is about the votes. And we’ve spent no more than a week talking about Ruth, Mays, and all the other greats. Whereas we’ve been pondering and commenting on Kevin Brown for about 120 weeks.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Voomo Zanzibar

I see your point, Voomo. However… what is there to be said about Ruth or Mays that hasn’t been said? I really don’t think there’s any “discussion” to be had. It’s the Kevin Browns and Whitey Fords and Eddie Murrays and Roberto Alomars of the world that are WORTH discussing. We all know that Hank Aaron and Ted Williams were great; what’s the point in discussing them? We all know that Dwight Evans was unappreciated in his time – but just how great WAS he? How do Richie Ashburn and Kenny Lofton compare? Those are questions worth exploring – “how… Read more »

Brendan Bingham
Brendan Bingham
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

And my vote was purely strategic, not an expression that Ruth is less than COGworthy.

MikeD
MikeD
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Whitey Ford, Eddie Murray and Roberto Alomar are HOFers. I’ll leave it at that. : -)

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago

Easy choice for me – most rounds these days, I go with the “overqualified-new-guy-and-my-two-stand-bys” ballot, and so it shall be today, as well:

Harry Heilmann
Kevin Brown
Luis Tiant

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

I haven’t stumped for Kevin Brown in a while, so I’m going to do so this round. While I personally have Harry Heilmann as the #1 player this round, I can see the argument for Kevin Brown (especially if you take level of competition into it at all), and I really wouldn’t mind seeing it happen. Here’s the thing. I understand the weaknesses and why people might shy away from Kevin Brown votes. First, there’s the Mitchell Report – I understand that that’s a deal-breaker for some people. I can’t change your mind about that, so I won’t try. I… Read more »

David P
David P
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Doom – I would argue that there’s another concern re: Brown. Extreme road-home split. His ERA was 2.74 at home, 3.86 on the road. I get that some people feel that WAR adequately addresses that sort of split but there’s hardly a unanimous consensus on the issue. Per your #18 about discussing candidates, I wonder why this issue doesn’t get discussed re: Brown. It can’t be from lack of interest…it was certainly discussed with Koufax and Walker. I assume it must be because people aren’t aware of Brown’s extreme split. How extreme is it? Of the 325 pitchers with 2,000+… Read more »

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

I wasn’t aware that the home-road disparity was that big, either, so it wouldn’t surprise me that others didn’t know. I DO recall, though, that some of his good years in Texas were obscured by a hitter’s park, and any success he had in LA was always attributed to Dodger Stadium, rather than to any skill of his own (mostly, as I recall, by bitter Dodger fans who didn’t believe he was living up to his big, fat contract). In his defense, though, I will say a couple of things. First, while the difference in his home and road ERAs… Read more »

David P
David P
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Appreciate the reply Doom. A bit of pushback. 🙂 Let’s look at the full picture of tOPS+. I did a search of pitchers with 2,300+ IP (wanted to include Koufax plus get fewer than 300 results). That returns 237 pitchers. Pitchers with a 90 home tOPS+ (like Brown) are between 15th to 25th on that list of 237 pitchers. So even using something like tOPS+, Brown comes in as an outlier. Sure there are some pitchers with a similar tOPS+, but most have a higher number than Brown. Beyond that, I don’t see the pitchers you listed as good comps… Read more »

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Thanks for yet another well-thought-out reply. I know I’m not going to convince many voters, because many people have things against Kevin Brown. What I will say is this: yes, even be tOPS+, Brown is an outlier… but so are a LOT of great pitchers. Pitching outstandingly at home will do that to a guy. As for why I chose the guys I did, they were from Koufax’s comp list (Guidry and Drysdale) or just the greatest pitchers of all-time, simply because I was curious. I wasn’t trying to “prove” anything necessarily, other than the fact that many great pitchers… Read more »

David P
David P
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Fair enough Doom. But let me ask you this? Why Brown and not Tiant or Reuschel?

They both have a similar amount of WAR/WAA as Brown without any of the negatives (at least that I’m aware of)?

I realize that you did vote for Tiant but didn’t try to build a case for him. And Reuschel has over 70 WAR if you include his hitting WAR.

I’m just having a hard time seeing a compelling case for Brown over those two.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Short answer: I picked Brown for two reasons. First because, at the time, he was winning, and so I thought it would be appropriate to write about him. Second, he’s been on the ballot longer, and I don’t think we’ve discussed his merits in a LONG time. Those of us who vote for him do so by rote, and those who don’t do so uncritically. I think it’s worth some of us restating our cases for our longtime “causes.” In fact, I would LOVE to see some more people pick a player from their ballot in the next round or… Read more »

David P
David P
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Thanks for the well-thought out response Doom! Honestly, I think the reason most people aren’t writing these sort of support pieces is because there’s no strong feeling for one candidate over another at this point. I voted for Lyons because I think he’d have 75-8 WAR without WWII. I think someone like that deserves to stay on the ballot, even if I’m not convinced he belongs in the COG. I voted for Tiant because I think he’s been unfairly viewed by history and everything says that he was an amazing person, beloved by fans and teammates alike. I voted for… Read more »

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

1. Herb Pennock – Well, I’m not sure he’s the most recent, but Roy Halladay did that from 2006-2011.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

4. Harry Heilmann – Bobby Abreu and Todd Helton, who both did it from 2002-2007.

Artie Z.
Artie Z.
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

6. Frank Snyder – Unless you mean “exactly 100 runs less” then Ted Simmons did this multiple times (1972, 1973, and 1975), peaking at a difference of 130 in 1973 (he had a differential of 97 in 1974).

Artie Z.
Artie Z.
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

12. Al Marnaux – I thought this was ridiculously easy (some guy named Ryan) until I read the NL qualifier. However, J.R. Richard walked 151 for the Astros in 1976 while winning 20 games.

Gary Bateman
Gary Bateman
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

I believe the answer to the Joe Judge question is Stuffy McInnis.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

7. Lee Meadows – Tom Hughes in 1904 – 11 losses with the Yanks, then 12 with the Senators. Yikes.

Artie Z.
Artie Z.
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

9. Sparky Adams – the immortal Juan Pierre.

2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2007, 2010

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

14. Hank DeBerry: Jeff Torborg and Buck Martinez

Gary Bateman
Gary Bateman
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Bing Miller question–Nap Lajoie?

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

3. Rube Bressler: Hal Newhouser and Joe Coleman Jr.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Is it Frank Shellenback?

Brent
Brent
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

#5 Bing Miller question is everyone’s favorite World Series goat, Bill Buckner.

Brent
Brent
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Howard Ehmke question: I will take a stab and say the 37 year old Randy Johnson in 2001.

Gary Bateman
Gary Bateman
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Butch Henline question–Spud Davis?

Gary Bateman
Gary Bateman
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Larry Woodall question–is it Pudge Rodriguez?

Brent
Brent
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

#11 — Jack Powell?

Doug
Doug
8 years ago
Reply to  Brent

Nope.

Powell had a losing record (117-143) with the Browns.

Brent
Brent
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

How about Bill Dinneen?

Doug
Doug
8 years ago
Reply to  Brent

That’s our man.

Dinneen was the star of the first World Series for the victorious Boston Americans, with 4 CG including two shutouts, one in the clinching game.

Hartvig
Hartvig
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

Would #10 (Bill Wambsganss) happen to be Buddy Bell in 1972?

Doug
Doug
8 years ago
Reply to  Hartvig

Indeed it would, except it was the 1973 season with 7 thefts in 22 attempts for a .318 success rate.

Hartvig
Hartvig
8 years ago
Reply to  Doug

And of course right you are, it was 1973.

Bill James once mentioned something about how the Indians had a bit of a mania for utilizing the hit-and-run far, far more often than most back in those days and how that at least contributed to Buddy’s abysmal career stolen base success rate (55/134 or 41%). That was what made me think of him.

Seems plausible to me.

Andy
Andy
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann, Kevin Brown, Goose Goslin

JEV
JEV
8 years ago

Heilmann, Goslin, Hartnett

Jeff Harris
Jeff Harris
8 years ago

Heilmann, Brown, Goslin

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago

Chris Heston threw a no-hitter for SF last night.
With 3 HBP.

Has any pitcher ever hit 3 batters without giving up a base hit?
The Play Index at b-r says no.

Two batters is the tops.

This gem by Steve Barber (with 10 walks!):

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/BAL/BAL196704301.shtml

____

Bo Belinsky on May 5th, 1962
Virgil Trucks, May 15th,1952
________________

The Play Index is wrong, though.
Because the reason I looked it up is that I remembered this game:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/PIT/PIT197405010.shtml

Artie Z.
Artie Z.
8 years ago
Reply to  Voomo Zanzibar

Voomo – the play index shows 4 games with 3 HBP and 0 hits.

The Heston game from last night, the Dock Ellis game you mention, and two games from 1914:

Rube Benton:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CIN/CIN191409100.shtml

Ted Welch:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/BRF/BRF191405150.shtml

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago
Reply to  Artie Z.

Yup, it’s working for me now, too.
When I ran it last night it would only display complete games, no matter what IP i chose.

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago

Bill Wambsganss batted .352 in his final season.
In 66 PA.

What is the highest BA in a final season?
Minimum 60 PA:

.389 / 96 … Timo Perez
.385 / 70 … Dave Rowan (1911)
.382 / 649 .. Joe Jackson
.377 / 187 .. Babe Twombley

Perez was a Dominican who started his career in Japan.
And had plenty left in the tank after his .389 in 2007:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/p/perezti01.shtml

Mo
Mo
8 years ago

Ashburn Reuschel Dwight Evans

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago

Rube Bressler’s rookie season netted him 3.7 Pitching WAR. Arm injury ended that career at age 25, and he went on to be an effective position player, with a .301 career average. He had two seasons of 3.0 WAR as an offensive player. Who else did that? Just looking at the top 15 guys in Games Pitched on this list: http://www.baseball-reference.com/friv/fieldPitch.shtml here is an unofficial list of who else had seasons of 3+ WAR both as a hitter and a Pitcher: John Ward Mike Smith (ahhh, the 1880s) Cy Seymour Bobby Wallace G.H. Ruth Johnny Cooney comes close, topping out… Read more »

Hartvig
Hartvig
8 years ago
Reply to  Voomo Zanzibar

Smokey Joe Wood, who was even a better pitcher than the Babe, managed oWAR seasons of 2.2, 2.3 & 2.4. George Sisler topped out at 1.3 & 1.0 WAR as a pitchers but those totals were in a mere 70 & 27(!) innings pitched.

J.R.
J.R.
8 years ago

Killebrew, Winfield, and Harry Heilmann

David P
David P
8 years ago

Anyone know the backstory on Heilmann’s breakthrough in 1921?

Through 1920, he had a career OPS+ of 121; the rest of his career it was 158. Similarly, through 1925 he never had an Rbat above 25. He then reeled of off 10 straight seasons above that level, including 4 above 50.

The end of the dead ball era can explain his jump in counting stats but can’t (I don’t think) explain the jump in advanced stats.

Where his skills just better suited to the live ball era? Or perhaps something else?

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

He received batting instructions from Ty Cobb starting in 1921.

David P
David P
8 years ago

Are you sure Richard? Heilmann’s SABR bio says that Cobb was pissed that Heilmann beat him out for the 1921 batting crown and refused to talk with him again. Which makes me think he wouldn’t be very inclined to give him batting instruction.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

Heilmann’s SABR bio also says that Cobb tutored him early in the 1921 season. Evidently Cobb was an excellent tutor.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann’s peak years, 1921-1927. Here’s how he ranked during those years: R………..4th H………..2nd behind only Hornsby 2B……….3rd 3B……….7th HR……….8th RBI………2nd behind only Ruth BB……….7th BA……….2nd behind only Hornsby OBP, SLG, OPS, OPS+, WAR….3rd behind only Ruth and Hornsby. I also checked rolling 5-year batting averages from 1921 to 1930. For those 6 periods Hornsby was on top 5 times and Heilmann was the one to break the string. Heilmann was 1 of 2 players to bat .393 or higher 4 times in his career and 1 of a handful to bat over .400. He was also the first player… Read more »

David P
David P
8 years ago

I imagine the “new kid on the block” will win. So I’ll go with Lyons, Nettles, and Tiant.

Gary Bateman
Gary Bateman
8 years ago

Heilmann, Goslin, Ashburn

latefortheparty
latefortheparty
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann
Goose Goslin
Graig Nettles

PaulE
PaulE
8 years ago

Winfield, Heilmann, Pennock

KalineCountry
KalineCountry
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann
Goose Goslin
Campy

T-Bone
T-Bone
8 years ago

Reuschel, Hartnett, Heilmann.

Darien
8 years ago

Killebrew, Eckersley, and Wilhelm

Artie Z.
Artie Z.
8 years ago

Heilmann, Kevin Brown, Nettles

dr-remulak
dr-remulak
8 years ago

Nettles, Winfield, Heilmann.

Kirk
Kirk
8 years ago

Killebrew, Reuschel and Heilmann

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago

Early voting returns, with 18 precincts reporting:

14 – Harry Heilmann
=====================75% (15)
=====================50% (9)
7 – Goose Goslin
5 – Kevin Brown
=====================25% (5)
4 – Graig Nettles
3 – Gabby Hartnett, Harmon Killebrew, Rick Reuschel, Dave Winfield
2 – Richie Ashburn, Roy Campanella, Dennis Eckersley, Luis Tiant
1 – Dwight Evans, Ted Lyons, Herb Pennock, Hoyt Wilhelm

Voomo Zanzibar
Voomo Zanzibar
8 years ago

Vote:

Dennis Eckersley
Ted Lyons
Hoyt Wilhelm

Brent
Brent
8 years ago

Dr. Doom convinced me, this will be my first ballot with Kevin Brown.

So, Heilmann, Goslin, Brown

Hartvig
Hartvig
8 years ago

Campanella, Hartnett, Lyons

Joseph
Joseph
8 years ago

Heilmann, Kevin Brown, Nettles

Steven
Steven
8 years ago

Heilmann, Goslin, Hartnett.

MJ
MJ
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann, Rick Reuschel, Kevin Brown

Shard
Shard
8 years ago

Harry Heilmann – Richie Ashburn – Rick Reuschel

Stephen
Stephen
8 years ago

Killebrew, Brown, Ashburn

oneblankspace
8 years ago

Killebrew
Wilhelm
Lyons

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago

Sunday AM, 27-ballot (oneblankspace @80) update, comin’ atcha:

19 – Harry Heilmann
====================50% (14)
9 – Kevin Brown, Goose Goslin*
====================25% (7)
5 – Gabby Hartnett, Harmon Killebrew*, Graig Nettles, Rick Reuschel
4 – Richie Ashburn, Ted Lyons
3 – Roy Campanella*, Dennis Eckersley, Hoyt Wilhelm*, Dave Winfield
====================10% (3)
2 – Luis Tiant
1 – Dwight Evans, Herb Pennock

(* = not on bubble)

aweb
aweb
8 years ago

Brown
Reuschel
Killebrew

Hub Kid
Hub Kid
8 years ago

Luis Tiant, Richie Ashburn, Dwight Evans

no statistician but
no statistician but
8 years ago

I think there’s potential for a good discussion in comparing Heilmann and Goslin. Heilmann was the better hitter after Cobb took him under his tutelage, however briefly, but the Goose was far better in the field—which probably only shows how truly awful Heilmann was—and on the bases, scored and drove in more runs, was an important part of five championship teams, and in spite of playing the majority of his career in HR-killing Griffith Stadium, retired with 248 homers to his credit. He also did some major damage in those five world series, seven HRs, 19 RBIs, 16 runs, and… Read more »

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago

Of Goslin’s 248 HR 156 were on the road and 92 were at home. That road-home differential of 64 is second only to Joe DiMaggio’s 65.

no statistician but
no statistician but
8 years ago

It’s really worse than that. Only 38 of his HRs came at Griffith, so the balance of the 92 were hit in St. Louis and Detroit, more or less. He might have hit a couple at Griffith as a visitor.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago

He hit 31 at Griffith as a Senator, 5 as a Tiger and 2 as a Brown.

mosc
mosc
8 years ago

I don’t think there is that much between them, no. I’m not convinced Heilmann is a shoe-in like he’s getting voted and I have Goslin below the line. If you really think guys like Eckersly, Nettles, Killebrew, etc belong than guys like Heilmann are the ones you’re going to have to leave OFF. That doesn’t seem to be the case so I have to think we’re now looking at a holdover list where more than half won’t make it.

Hartvig
Hartvig
8 years ago
Reply to  mosc

I see Heilmann as being slightly above the line & Goose as just below it. But I also think that there are at least 2 better qualified holdovers than Heilmann and a couple more that are roughly equal.

That does seem to be one “flaw” in our voting system- new guys seem to get support somewhat out of proportion to their relative talent, especially if they’re obviously the only qualified candidate among the newcomers.

The real difficulty on the horizon that the Tiger fan in me sees on the horizon is going to be Sam Crawford.

Chris C
Chris C
8 years ago

Eckersley, Tiant, Lyons

David P
David P
8 years ago

Here’s a question for the PI masters. Is Joe Judge’s 46.9 career WAR the most for someone who never had a single season above 4.0 WAR?

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

There are 193 players with 46.9 WAR or higher. They all have 3 or more seasons with 4.0+ WAR except Judge who has only 1. So the answer to your question is yes.

David P
David P
8 years ago

Thanks Richard! I imagine this is impossible to search but I’m guessing that Judge’s 14 straight seasons with WAR between 2.2 and 4.0 is some sort of record. (i.e, most straight seasons with WAR within a range of +/- 2.0).

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

I have to explain a discrepancy. Joe Judge’s home page shows 2 seasons of 4.0 WAR but my PI run showed 1 season. For my PI run I used WAR => 4.0. I reran it using WAR => 3.95 and then 2 seasons showed up for Judge. By using WAR => 4.04, Judge again has one season. By using WAR => 4.05 Judge’s name did not come up so his maximum WAR is 4.04.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

Hank Aaron had 14 straight seasons within a range of 2.6 WAR, which is a little larger, but MUCH more impressive because it was at a higher level: 6.8-9.4 WAR (1956-1969).

mosc
mosc
8 years ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

I agree if this is some kind of consistency stat then it shouldn’t punish guys who were just better. I would do it by percentage. A guy going form 0.1WAR to 0.2WAR has double his WAR output. Aaron is going to win a huge number of nyear consistency checks on WAR output if it’s percentage of the period’s average based.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago
Reply to  David P

@94, David: After the 2014 season ended I created a spreadsheet to calculate consecutive seasons of a any particular stat. Your question provided me with a chance to use it. I extracted data from Fangraphs because it was easier to extract seasonal WAR values for all MLers than from BR. Their range of WAR for Judge for that 14 consecutive season streak varied from 1.8 to 4.1. Accordingly I ran my analysis for that range. Judge’s streak showed up to be the record. Tied for second were Torii Hunter, Michael Young and Brian Downing with 9 consecutive years.

David P
David P
8 years ago

Just seeing this…Thanks Richard!

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
8 years ago

@120: You are welcome.

koma
koma
8 years ago

Harmon Killebrew, Hoyt Wilhelm, Dennis Eckersley

Josh
Josh
8 years ago

Harry Heilman, Gabby Hartnett, Dave Winfield

Mike G.
Mike G.
8 years ago

Brown, Tiant, Hartnett

MikeD
MikeD
8 years ago

Heilmann, Killebrew, Nettles

brp
brp
8 years ago

Wilhelm
Ashburn
K. Brown

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
8 years ago

Here’s another vote update, since it’s been 48 hours since my last. This is through brp’s vote @102, the 35th:

21 – Harry Heilmann
=====================50% (18)
12 – Kevin Brown
9 – Goose Goslin*
=====================25% (9)
8 – Harmon Killebrew*
7 – Gabby Hartnett
6 – Richie Ashburn, Graig Nettles, Rick Reuschel
5 – Dennis Eckersley, Ted Lyons, Luis Tiant, Hoyt Wilhelm
4 – Dave Winfield
=====================10% (4)
3 – Roy Campanella
2 – Dwight Evans
1 – Herb Pennock

(* = not on bubble)

David Horwich
David Horwich
8 years ago

Campanella, Hartnett, Winfield

bstar
8 years ago

Lyons, Eckersley, Wilhelm

robbs
robbs
8 years ago

Heilman Goslin Hartnett

PP
PP
8 years ago

Heilman, Killebrew, Campanella