Circle of Greats 1965 Results: Hurt’s So Good

Frank Thomas, The Big Hurt, capped strong showings in each of our COG votes so far with a solid victory, appearing on 52 of 79 ballots cast to earn induction.  More on Thomas, and the voting, after the jump.

A few career slash lines:

Mickey Mantle .421 OBP/.557 SLG/.977 OPS
Stan Musial .417 OBP/.559 SLG/.976 OPS
Frank Thomas .419 OBP/.555 SLG/.974 OPS
Joe DiMaggio .398 OBP/.579 SLG/.977 OPS

Only Mantle’s career OPS+ was significantly different than the others — 172 compared to 159 for Musial, 156 for Thomas and 155 for DiMaggio.

In the Circle of Greats voting, no player other than Thomas managed to top the 50% mark this round, though Mike Mussina came close, falling just three votes short — that leaves him with two rounds of eligibility awarded instead of the four he would have won with a 50% showing.  Craig Biggio  (41%) and Tom Glavine (39%) also each easily earned two rounds of eligibility; the less personally popular Curt Schilling (at least among HHSers) also won two rounds but with not as much room to spare at 31%.  John Smoltz and Roberto Alomar were each at the very edge of the 25% mark that would earn them two rounds of eligibility.  Smoltz with 20 votes finished just over the 25% mark, and adds two more rounds of eligibility to his collection.   Alomar with 19 votes fell just short, and will have to get by with a one-round extension.   Larry Walker at 15% survives into the next round as well.  Lastly, there was a tight battle for the final carry-over spot between Kenny Lofton and Kevin Brown, but some careful tactical voting ultimately led to a happy tie between them (5 votes each): under the rules that’s as good as a win for both — Lofton and Brown each survive at least one more round.

0 0 votes
Article Rating
Subscribe
Notify of
guest
9 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Hartvig
Hartvig
9 years ago

I believe it was my vote that created the tie between Lofton and Brown and to be honest I wouldn’t tell you which of the 2 I cast it for to create that tie. Looking at this years ballot I see no chance of them both getting thru again but I do see how it might be possible for at least 1 of them to make it so I’m satisfied with my decision to do that. To be honest I would have been happier if my vote had led to a 2 year extension for Alomar or a 4 year… Read more »

MikeD
MikeD
9 years ago

Well, at least Thomas has been removed from my future votes. Mussina and Alomar remain. On to 1964.

mosc
mosc
9 years ago

I think awarding the worst DWAR score of all time (not verified. No idea how to check it) to a DH is absurd. I even think he wasn’t as horrible as indicated at first either. I guess I take some comfort in seeing some voter support one of the best hitters of all time independent of incorrect fielding metrics.

John Autin
Editor
9 years ago
Reply to  mosc

mosc, FWIW, Gary Sheffield rates far below Thomas in dWAR. Here’s some of the all-time worst dWAR ratings; I don’t know where to find a systematic list, but I believe Sheff is the worst. – G.Sheffield -28.6 – A.Dunn -25.2 – F.Howard -24.1 – F.Thomas -23.3 – Manny -22.5 – G.Luzinski -20.8 I’ll add that the majority of Thomas’s negative dWAR came in his first 8 seasons, when he mostly played 1B. During his first 7 full years, he averaged -1.2 dWAR/162G, whereas after switching to DH he -0.9 dWAR/162G. So, FWIW, the dWAR method agrees with the White Sox,… Read more »

bstar
bstar
9 years ago
Reply to  John Autin

At -20.2 dWAR, Harold Baines might be next on the list.

Here’s JA’s list plus some other names I found, from a rate perspective(dWAR/150 games):

Adam Dunn -2.20
Frank Howard -1.91
Greg Luzinski -1.71
Gary Sheffield -1.67
Ryan Howard -1.52
Frank Thomas -1.51
Manny Ramirez -1.47
Dante Bichette -1.46
David Ortiz -1.33
Harold Baines -1.07

Simple rounding may have skewed the results a bit on those really close in value, and I’m sure there are other names out there.

Ed
Ed
9 years ago
Reply to  bstar

Danny Tartabull’s upset that no one’s mentioned him yet. Using Bstar’s metric of dWAR/150 games, he comes in second worst of all-time at -2.02.

bstar
bstar
9 years ago
Reply to  Ed

I just found Tartabull, too, Ed. He’s at -18.5 dWAR for his career, while Jeff Burroughs (-19.5/-1.73 per 150) and Matt Stairs (-17.3/ -1.37 per 150) deserve mention also.

Ed
Ed
9 years ago
Reply to  Ed

Here’s an odd Tartabull factoids: He had 5 seasons of 100 or more RBIs, but never topped 102 RBIs.