MVP Elections – 1963 AL

elston-howardHowdy, everyone! It’s our first AL post – though, admittedly, we’re still stuck in the early-60s.

1963 was oddly typical (that may be an oxymoron, but I’m going to let it stand). The Yankees won the AL for the 13th time in 15 years (they’d win the next year, too), so that was no change. A Yankee was named MVP for the 10th time in that 15 year span – so again, nothing new, particularly since Yankees catchers won more MVPs in this stretch than their teammates at other positions. Pythagoras had the Yankees and White Sox two games apart, but the Yanks actually won it by 10 in the win column, with each team missing its expected wins by four, but in opposite directions.

New York moved into a tie for first on June 15th, and never relinquished its lead. The Yanks and ChiSox were tied again as late as June 28th, but after facing each other and splitting the Independence Day double-header at the Stadium, New York was again up by 4.5, and stretched that lead out to 14 games before a late-season tanking (losing 5 of their final 9) brought the Yankees back to the 10.5 game margin they finished the season with. The Yankees started the season 41-28 (their mark on June 28th, when the White Sox were last in contact), then shifted into another gear the rest of the way, posting almost exactly the same number in the loss column, but adding 50% more wins to finish 63-29 (even with the late season mini-swoon). It… uh… was a pretty unexciting year.

But not only was it an unexciting year in the junior circuit on a team level – it was much the same on a player level, too. After seeing the HR record broken two years earlier and seeing a Triple Crown less than a decade ago, there wasn’t too much going on in 1963. While Sandy Koufax rewrote the record book in the NL, pitching in the AL was excellent, but hardly historic. Likewise, the RBI leader had only 118 and didn’t finish in the top-12 in MVP voting. No one scored 100 runs, only four players hit .300, and only two hit 40 HR. No one even came CLOSE to a .600 SLG (with the leader at only .555), leaving the voters in a quandary – when no one is great, who is best?

As should come as no surprise if you’ve been paying attention to the first couple posts, the top 13 vote-getters come from only 5 teams – the top three, plus the 5th and 7th place teams (there was only one from the 5th-place Tigers, but there was a perhaps inexplicable amount of love shown to 7th place Red Sox – but I digress). My read of the situation is this: when confronted with no easy choice, the voters went with the fallback – strength up the middle. In this case, the lucky winner was Yankees’ Elston Howard. Bill James has said many times that Howard certainly had the talent to be a Hall of Fame player, but that circumstances (well, a circumstance named “Yogi Berra“, in his final season in pinstripes) basically held him back from getting the requisite playing time necessary to earn his way to Cooperstown. Howard hit .287/.342/.528, the last ranking third in the AL – which is pretty great for a catcher. In 135 games, Howard scored 75 and drove in 85 while hitting 28 home runs.

Speaking of “strength up the middle,” three other Yankees finished in the top 11 in MVP voting. Tom Tresh, the previous season’s RoY winner at shortstop, played mostly CF (as Mickey Mantle managed only 65 games due to injury) and acquitted himself well in a new and demanding position that the Mick and fellow legend Joe DiMaggio had manned almost exclusively in the Bronx for the preceding 25+ seasons. Tresh slashed a respectable .269/.371/.487, added 25 HR, and didn’t embarrass himself on defense. But, speaking of embarrassment, the MVP voters should have been, as they actually placed Yankee second baseman Bobby Richardson ahead of Tresh on their ballots, notwithstanding that Richardson was objectively terrible on offense in 1962, producing a typically underwhelming .265/.294/.330 slash that suggested an over-matched Triple-A player – not a tenth-place finisher in the MVP race. Sure, he was valuable on defense… but THAT valuable?

The other Yankee to show up in the MVP vote was 3rd place finisher Whitey Ford – another up-the-middle player. Ford’s credentials were typically solid, certainly more so than the other down-ballot Yankees. Though he didn’t show up in Cy Young voting (Koufax snagged all 20 CYA first place votes for a title that was still four years away from being awarded in each league), Ford went 24-7, with those 24 W’s (and the .774 W%) leading the league (no one else had more than 21 wins). Ford also led in starts (37) and innings (269.1), and was fourth in Ks (with 189 – it was a different world back then), doing all of that about as stingily as he could, with a 2.74 ERA.

Al Kaline was the runner-up in MVP voting for a Tigers team that played itself out of contention early (29-46) but finished well (50-37). Kaline batted .312/.375/.514, with 89 R, 101 RBI, and 27 HR. It’s a middling season in the scope of his career… but in a year with no standouts, it apparently stood out enough to make voters take notice.

While Kaline was the MVP runner-up, the best candidate from the AL runner-up White Sox was a guy who hit .259/.287/.444, which doesn’t sound that great… until you realize that it’s Rookie of the Year pitcher Gary Peters. Peters went 19-8 with a league-leading 2.33 ERA in 243 IP, while matching Ford with those same 189 Ks. Peters’ 1.070 WHIP was third in the league, but only .007 behind leader Ralph Terry of the Yankees. The Sox had another outstanding rookie in third baseman Pete Ward who batted .295/.353/.482 with 22 HR, 84 RBI and 80 R, to finish just behind Peters in both the RoY and MVP voting.

Speaking of Sox, the Red variety, in spite of a disappointing season, had some MVP love. This is probably because the league-leader in RBI (Dick “Dr. Strangeglove” Stuart, with 118 ribbies and famously terrible defense), batting average (Carl Yastrzemski at .321) and ERA (Dick Radatz, who, as a reliever, didn’t technically qualify, but posted a sparkling 1.97) were all BoSox. Stuart hit a rather miserable (except for slugging) .261/.312/.521, but his league lead in RBI and 2nd-place finish in HR (42) caused him to be noticed… in 13th place. Yaz scored 91, 3rd in the AL, but knocked in only 68, which the voters can’t much have liked. He did, however, hit 40 two-baggers to go along with his league-leading .418 OBP and 10th-place SLG (.475), placing him 3rd in OPS playing in hitter-friendly Fenway.

The only other team that finished near the top of both the standings and the MVP voting was the Minnesota Twins, posting a second straight 91 win season (good for 3rd behind the White Sox) that presaged their pennant-winning campaign two years hence. Catcher Earl Battey‘s 7th place in the MVP vote is a bit hard to figure; he hit .285/.369/.476 with 26 HR, 84 RBI, and 64 R, nearly identical to, albeit a touch poorer than, Elston Howard’s year. Battey’s every-fourth-day battery-mate Camilo Pascual was 21-9 with a 2.46 ERA in 248.1 IP, while striking out a league-leading 202. The team’s top vote-getter was Harmon Killebrew, who led the league with 45 HR and .555 slugging, and was second in OPS (.904). His .349 OBP was workmanlike, not spectacular, and his .258 average can’t have helped endear him to the BBWAA of 1963. Killer’s 96 RBI were 3rd in the AL, but, in a down year, his 88 R don’t look so bad. The great stumper is why Bob Allison fared so poorly with the voters in 1963. Renowned for his defense, Allison led the AL with 99 R and a .911 OPS. He mashed 35 HR (3rd), drove in 91 (4th), and was 3rd and 2nd, respectively, in OBP (.378) and SLG (.533). Doesn’t seem like 15th place to me, so maybe he’s worth another look.

So who’ll it be: A Yank, Mr. Tiger, a Sock (Red or White), or a Twin? Could it possibly be someone else? I know I’ve given a lot of candidates this week, but it’s a particularly confounding year. So let’s discuss for three days and vote for four!

DIRECTIONS: Please list 5-10 players on your MVP ballot (ballots with fewer than 5 candidates will be thrown out). Ballots will be scored as per BBWAA scoring (14-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1). Strategic voting is discouraged, though unenforceable, so please just don’t do it, as the goal here is to (somewhat) mimic the BBWAA process. The post will be live for about a week; please discuss and vote whenever you’d like, but there will be no vote changes, so don’t vote until you’re sure you’re ready!

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57 Comments on "MVP Elections – 1963 AL"

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Richard Chester
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As of 1963 there had been 11 African-American MVPs in the NL to none in the AL. The writers may have decided to seize on the opportunity to vote for an African-American for the AL MVP.

Hartvig
Guest
That disparity may have been at it’s peak in 1963. You look at the top talent in the NL- Mays, Aaron, Frank Robinson, Clemente, McCovey, Gibson, Brock, Banks, Billy Williams and on down the line and then compare it to the AL and it becomes painfully obvious as to why the NL was 1 year in to a string of 20 all-star game victories in 21 years. I’m having difficulty in naming someone other than who was mentioned in the article. Jim Fregosi had a very solid first full season. Bill Freehan showed promise of what was to come. Stu… Read more »
Paul E
Guest
Richard, To your point, I believe, if I searched it correctly, BR PI shows only Doby and Minoso (as AL AA’s/black Latins) among the top 40 in WAR for the period 1947 – 1963. So, yeah, why not Howard in such a year where no one truly stands out? There seems to be a general bias toward “up the middle” players in the voting from back then. But, I believe it could be argued that Doby should have gotten serious consideration in several seasons of the 1950’s and certainly Minoso was, at minimum, a borderline Hall of Famer.
Richard Chester
Guest

There was also Al Smith in the top 40.

Paul E
Guest

And, if I did it correctly, PI indicates only 3 seasons among the Top 40 in the AL for the period 1947 – 1963:
8.2 1954 Minoso
7.1 1952 Doby
6.7 1950 Doby

HMDA (Home Mortgage Disclosure Act) information was not available on Bobby Avila. I do know he checks the box, “Hispanic or Latino” for Ethnicity; however, I do not know if he was checking “Black or African American” on the Race box

Voomo Zanzibar
Guest

Vote:

1. Bob Allison
2. Dick Radatz
3. Elston Howard
4. Carl Yastrzemski
5. Jimmie Hall
6. Gary Peters
7. Al Kaline
8. Tom Tresh
9. Camilo Pascual
10. Jim Bouton

no statistician but
Guest

You forgot to mention Willie Mays.

Hey, if he can win among our voters on a team (1960 Giants) that was 36-42 in the second half, falling from 5 to 16 games behind while his own OPS dropped to .808 from its 1.058 first half, then he can probably win for a league he didn’t even play in as compensation for the Koufax phenomenon. His 10.6 WAR beats any competition in the AL by over three points, after all.

Voomo Zanzibar
Guest

Mays vs Koufax in ’63:

.143 / .200 / .429 / .629

Career:

.278 / .426 / .536 / .962

Gary Bateman
Guest

1. Bob Allison
2. Elston Howard
3. Al Kaline
4. Dick Radatz
5. Earl Battey
6. Gary Peters
7. Carl Yastrzemski
8. Tom Tresh
9. Whitey Ford
10. Pete Ward

no statistician but
Guest
OK, we’ve had two votes for Bob Allison even before we’ve had any serious commentary, much less discussion. Well, here’s some commentary, then we might have some discussion. Allison, since he’s on people’s minds: His seasonal stats look impressive, but they don’t break down quite so well. I’m just going to stick with OPS to keep it simple: first half .968, second half .842; RISP .982 for the season; against the Yankees .454 (ouch), White Sox .845, Orioles .841, winning teams .718. The Twins on Sept 7 were a distant second to the Yankees at 80-62, went 11-9 down the… Read more »
Hartvig
Guest
Just to present a case for Allison, Radatz & Kaline- and maybe a couple others- a few points. The first would be that it’s not a players fault that the rest of the team isn’t very good or playing up to expectations. I understand that how a player performs in crucial games in a tight race (see Carl Yastrzemski in 1967) can maybe carry the team on his back or lift the game of those around him but those types of performances are few & far between. And a win in April or June counts the same as one in… Read more »
Doug
Guest

Re: performing well in crucial situations.

Allison ranked first in Situational Wins Added (i.e. WPA/LI) and second in WPA. Kaline was first in WPA, RE24 and REW (Wins version of RE24) by hefty margins, and second in WPA/LI.

no statistician but
Guest

Hartvig @ #13:

A win in June counts the same in the standings as a win in September, true, but a loss in September hurts a lot more than a loss in June when you’re in a pennant race, and a strategic win against the team you’re contending with has potential repercussions that can lift the winner and sink the loser. Further, tell the Pirates of 1938, Dodgers of 1951, and Red Sox of 1978—to name three prime examples—that late season wins don’t mean any more than early season ones. I think you’d get an argument.

David P
Guest

The idea that one player can protect another in the lineup has been disproven over and over and over again.

If Maris hit 61 homeruns because of having Mantle hitting behind him, then how to explain the year before?

In 1960, Maris put up a .750 OPS when batting 3rd (173 PAs, 5 HRs, mostly with Mantle batting after him).

Meanwhile, he put up a 1.063 OPS when batting 4th that year (288 PAs, 23 HRs, mostly with Mantle bating before him).

David P
Guest

Howard may be the only player in baseball history to play a higher percentage of his games at catcher, the older he got. In fact, his only 3 seasons playing exclusively at catcher were his age 33-35 seasons. We all know why, of course, but it’s still odd and I’m guessing unique.

Voomo Zanzibar
Guest
David P
Guest

Wow, where did you dig him up at, Voomo!!!??? Anyway, if you have to go back to the turn of last century to find another example, I think that kind of proves my point. Howard’s careeer was quite unique.

Voomo Zanzibar
Guest

David P, just clicking my mouse button… b-r did most of the work.

Doug
Guest

Mantle didn’t figure much in the Yankees success in 1963, but did manage to hit this memorable home run, an estimated 503 foot walk-off shot to beat the A’s.

http://hittrackeronline.com/historic.php?id=1963_3

1963 was also the year of this famous game.

no statistician but
Guest

Yeah, but if Mantle had played the whole season at the approximate level he played the 52 starts he did have, this discussion wouldn’t be relevant: Mantle as MVP in a landslide w/circa 120 runs scored, 40 HRs, 100 RBIs, 115 Walks, .314 BA, OPS+ of 196. Scale it all back by 10% and he’s still the prime suspect.

no statistician but
Guest
Mantle should have won the MVP in 1961, too. The main reason Maris won was the 61 HRs, and the main reason he broke Ruth’s record was that he had Mantle batting behind him, and the opposition would rather have faced Maris. In other words, Mickey played Lou Gehrig to Roger’s Babe, except that 1) Gehrig WON the MVP in 1927; 2) Maris was half the player Ruth was. Mantle probably deserved the award in 1955 instead of Yogi, 1958 instead of Jackie Jensen, 1961 instead of Maris. Add that to his 3 wins, two close seconds to Maris in… Read more »
Richard Chester
Guest

In 1927 the rule was that any player with an MVP award was ineligible for another one and Ruth was the MVP in 1923.

no statistician but
Guest

Richard:

I suspect Gehrig would still have won. He led the league in doubles, RBIs and total bases (30 more than Ruth), and extra base hits (20 more than Ruth) and was mostly second, sometimes third, in other significant categories. His oWAR was slightly better than Ruth’s, too, but playing first base to Ruth’s outfield held him back in the total WAR department.

Dr. Doom
Guest

nsb,

oWar includes the positional adjustment. The quality of Ruth and Gehrig’s defensive play, not their positions, is what puts Ruth ahead of Gehrig. Rbat, which is pure hiring, has Gehrig at 103 and Ruth at 102.

Doug
Guest

To your point, despite limited playing time, Mantle placed 10th in the AL in two counting stats, Adjusted Batting Runs and Adjusted Batting Wins, right behind Howard in both cases. Don’t know what these stats are, but they’re listed on B-R’s Leaders pages.

ATarwerdi96
Guest

1) Al Kaline
2) Bob Allison
3) Dick Radatz
4) Gary Peters
5) Carl Yastrzemski
6) Elston Howard
7) Jim Bouton
8) Jimmie Hall
9) Wayne Causey
10) Juan Pizarro

no statistician but
Guest
My vote: 1) Elston Howard. The first vote in this series for the actual winner. Why? Not only did he win the award convincingly, suggesting that to the 1963 voters he was unquestionably the MVP; but also no one else is very convincing as a replacement; his performance at a skill position was Golden Glove worthy; in a down year for Yankee hitting he handled the pitching staff that took up the slack; and he was at his best at the plate when Mantle was out of the lineup and hitting was needed most. 2) Dick Radatz. 3) Bob Allison… Read more »
Dr. Doom
Guest

Hey everyone!

Please fill out your ballot by 11:59 on Friday night. Our next ballot is going to stay in the 1960s, but we’re heading back to the NL. I think it should make for some interesting conversation – and it’s our final 1960s post, so we’re going to be moving on soon. Remember to fill out your ballots – I’ll be doing mine today, too!

Paul E
Guest

Il Signore Medico,
Presumptuous of me to suspect Ken Boyer’s award is in question?

David P
Guest

I’m guessing it will be ’66 NL.

You’ve got Clemente (8.2 WAR), Koufax (9.8 WAR), Mays (9.0 WAR), Marichal (9.8 WAR), Santo (8.9 WAR) as top candidates. Plus Aaron (7.8 WAR) and Allen (7.5 WAR) as possibilities.

Dr. Doom
Guest

Those are both good guesses. I had to make a lot of tough choices. I’m not going to tell you yet, but I’ll say that both of those were on much (much longer) first-draft list of possibilities for this project.

Dr. Doom
Guest
In a couple of posts on our 1960 election, I shared a few little calculations that I find interesting. First is what I call “Composite Average,” which takes into account Bill James’ observation that Secondary Bases ~ Hits ~ (R+RBI), totaling all those stats and dividing by AB (then dividing by 3, to scale to batting average). The second thing that I included is Run% – that is, the percentage of a player’s team’s runs that he either scored or drove in (no double-counting HR). Here are the players receiving votes so far, with those “stats” listed respectively: Howard: .309,… Read more »
Dr. Doom
Guest
I’m ready for my vote. Here are a few thoughts: First, I’m not sure why Killebrew would be ranked above Allison in voting. Allison had a better batting average, secondary average, was involved in more of his team’s runs, and played better defense at a tougher position. I literally have no understanding of how Killebrew ranked ahead, other than hitting more HR. Second, WOW are these pitchers hard to separate. I can see Peters, Ford, Bouton, and Pascual in just about any order, not to mention Dick Radatz, who doesn’t look identical to the others, but had his own kind… Read more »
Hartvig
Guest
Generally not a fan of starting pitchers for MVP unless they really stand out. Then again, if they’re clearly better than someone further down the ballot maybe they do meet that criteria. 1) Elston Howard I know defensive metrics from over 50 years ago are suspect but the Yankees pitching staff gave up 113 fewer runs than the average AL pitching staff. That’s gotta count for something. Add in that in different circumstances I think there’s every reason to believe that he would have had a HOF career and I don’t feel the tiniest bit guilty about giving him every… Read more »
Brendan Bingham
Guest
Hartvig: Thank you for mentioning Gary Peters’ bat. He was drafted by the White Sox as an outfielder but converted to a pitcher in the minor leagues. OPS paints him as a very good hitting pitcher for his career (.601), for the 1963 season (.732), and as a pinch hitter (.764 in 75 career PA). As a member of the Red Sox in 1971, he appeared as a pinch hitter 19 times, producing five hits, including two of the team’s four pinch hit home runs. Mike Fiore and Phil Gagliano did more pinch hitting for the ’71 Red Sox (40… Read more »
Paul E
Guest

1) Howard
2) Allison
3) Yaz
4) Pearson
5) Kaline
6) Tresh
7) Ward
8) Peters
9) Radatz
10) Pascual
Can’t take it away from Howard

Voomo Zanzibar
Guest
I just noticed that NY’s DP combo – Gregorius and Castro, tied for the team lead with 70 RBI. 70 ! Surely that’s a Yankees’ (low) record for the 162 game era. Nope. Two (un)beat it in the deadball 60’s: 62 … Roy White (1968) 64 … Joe Pepitone (1967) 70 … Grego-Stro (2016) 74 … Tom Tresh (1965) I also looked at the early years, ’81, and ’94. Didn’t look at anything else, so maybe there’s another, but here are the franchise records for shorter seasons based on my incomplete research: 44 … Charlie Hemphill (1908) 51 … Roger… Read more »
Voomo Zanzibar
Guest

Oops. Disregard that last line.
That was a question I was forming to the community before I decided to just click through a bunch of years.

Richard Chester
Guest

Other Yankee leaders with fewer than 80 RBI:
1965…Tom Tresh with 74
1959….Mickey Mantle with 75
2014….Brian McCann with 75
1906….Jimmy Williams with 77
1990….Jesse Barfield with 78

birtelcom
Editor
That was some outfield the Twins put together in the mid-60s. Top B-ref WAR for AL outfielders, 1963-1965: 1. Allison 18.0 MIN 2. Yaz 15.4 BOS 3. Kaline 13.8 DET 4. Hall 13.7 MIN 5. Killebrew 13.2 MIN 6. Oliva 12.2 MIN The 1963 Twins finished 13 games behind the Yankees, but just two back in the pythagorean standings that are based on run differential. This round I’ve used an average of B-ref WAR, fangraphs WAR and WPA, plus a bonus for catchers. My votes for 1963 AL MVP: 1. Bob Allison 2. Carl Yastrzemski 3. Elston Howard 4. Gary… Read more »
Brendan Bingham
Guest

My vote:
1) Bob Allison
2) Carl Yastrzemski
3) Elston Howard
4) Dick Radatz
5) Gary Peters
6) Jimmie Hall
7) Al Kaline
8) Ron Hansen
9) Camilo Pascual
10) Moe Drabowsky

Richard Chester
Guest
After giving it much thought I am voting for 6 players. It was not easy. 1) Al Kaline 2)Bob Allison 3)Harmon Killebrew 4)Elston Howard 5) Dick Radatz 6) Yaz Kaline led the league in BA with men on base and with RISP. I considered Stuart on the basis of his league-leading RBI but he came to bat with an inordinately high number of runners on base and his fielding was awful. What puzzles me is Yaz’s low total of RBI. He was second in the league in BA with runners on base and third with RISP. And I know that… Read more »
--bill
Guest

I’d vote for the combo Mantle/Maris if I could, but I can’t…

so here’s my list:
1. Bob Allison
2. Carl Yastrezemski
3. Elston Howard
4. Al Kaline
5. Albie Pearson
6. Jimmie Hall
7. Camilo Pascual
8. Gary Peters
9. Roger Maris
10. Ron Hansen

Doug
Guest

1. Kaline
2. Allison
3. Howard
4. Ward
5. Tresh
6. Yaz
7. Killebrew
8. Battey
9. Pearson
10. Hall

Dr. Doom
Guest
Thanks for your participation in the 1963 AL MVP vote! Here are your complete results;* the first number is the points they earned, with first place votes in parentheses: 1. Bob Allison, 131 (5) 2. Elston Howard, 117 (4) 3. Al Kaline, 101 (3) 4. Carl Yastrzemski, 77 5. Dick Radatz, 63 6. Gary Peters, 46 7. Tom Tresh, 23 8. Jimmie Hall, 21 9. Camilo Pascual, 20 10. Albie Pearson, 18 11. Earl Battey & Pete Ward, 14 13. Harmon Killebrew, 13 14. Whitey Ford, 9 15. Jim Bouton, 5 16. Ron Hansen, 4 17. Wayne Causey & Roger… Read more »
no statistician but
Guest

I dunno. At this point all we’re electing is the WAR leader.

Prediction: Santo wins.

Next prediction: Following winner leads in WAR.

Ditto.

Dr. Doom
Guest
So far, and for most of the 1960s picks, the WAR leader so far has been clear. When we get to some of the later elections, we have ties, or narrow margins, or a few guys within 1.0 WAR of one another. I would also note that, while the winner and WAR leader matched up, the down-ballot votes did not fall down strictly WAR-based lines. Even if you get rid of pitchers, Yaz, Hall, Kaline, Howard, Pearson, Fregosi, Killebrew, Battey, Ward is not even close to how our vote turned out. Fregosi, Killebrew, and Battey were barely mentioned, in favor… Read more »
Mike L
Guest
NSB is alluding to an important point. I’m finding it hard to participate in this because I don’t think I have enough of a feel for context within each of the seasons, and I don’t necessarily want to rely only on WAR. I’d like to see more discussion about the seasons themselves–the voters at the time were reacting to more than just pure numbers. No-one thought Willie Stargell the best player in 1979, but he was the sentimental choice because he was the 39-year “Pops” on a WS winning team that had a great theme song. Stargell was an extreme… Read more »
Paul E
Guest

yes, the Sporting News had (s?) a Player of the Year Award which,if we merely utilize WAR, is what this exercise will turn out to be. I recall the proposed 1967 NL season as a Cardinal runaway. Based on that, I’ll make an strong argument for Cha Cha/ El Toro Nino and I don’t believe it will be close. So, yeah, context is king

David P
Guest

I agree Mike L. I was born in ’69 so I didn’t live through any of these seasons. And even in the “information age”, it’s hard to go back and re-construct the context of an entire baseball season. And so I have no idea who to vote for. Hopefully that will change once we get to seasons that I actually remember.

Dr. Doom
Guest
I understand the frustration all of you have with this situation. That’s partly why I started the series in 1960 – I was hoping to catch seasons that people remembered. But please stick with it: there’s only one more in the ’60s, then only ONE post in the ’70s… but then four from the ’80s (which is an era most HHS posters seem to remember), and then 5 from a ten year span beginning in the late-1990s. So if you stick with it, while the first few can be frustrating, it will hopefully become more interesting as time goes on.
Mike L
Guest

Doom, I wasn’t criticizing–just pointing out a difficulty I was having personally. I think a decent portion of MVPs are at least in part story driven. I don’t see that as a reason to take a sentimental favorite over someone with substantially better stats, but it gets harder when you when you talk about value and try to place them in a group of ten.

bstar
Guest
I am cosigning with the above comments. I agree with Paul E — we are voting for the best player, not necessarily the most valuable. I get that for a lot of people “best player” is the most valuable player, but I don’t think that is an absolute. I also agree with some of nsb’s original thoughts on this that the sportswriters’ views on these elections need to be given a lot of respect. Maybe it’s just me, but in an 8-team league I think it’s possible/probable that they actually watched all the teams and all the players more than… Read more »
Paul E
Guest
“But I’m still glad Dr. Doom decided to do these things because this site greatly needs content.” Me, too. I think Bill James, maybe in the BJHBA, indicated that Mantle was the best player in the AL just about every year of his career that he was healthy. But, Berra still managed MVP’s. I believe as we move forward to more recent seasons, the input will be more informative and memory-driven as opposed to a mere re-hashing of statistics. Memorable things like Caminiti’s second half on his way to an MVP and Chipper Jones’ MVP season that may have been… Read more »
Howard
Guest

If Roger Maris had not been injured he may have won a remarkable three MVPs in an otherwise short and unremarkable career.

oneblankspace
Guest

Maris was right about Lolich (3-0) being a bigger problem for the Cardinals in the ’68 World Series than McLain (1-2).

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