July 4th game notes EXPANDED — now more noteworthy!

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Orioles 4, @Mariners 2: In his season debut, Chris Tillman didn’t allow a man past 1st base until his last batter, with 1 out in the 9th.

Adam Jones is on pace for exactly 40 HRs, but he doesn’t need that many to make a bit of history. Only one Orioles/Browns CF has ever hit at least 27 HRs in a season (Brady Anderson, 50 in 1996). We’re talking about an original AL franchise, folks. There have been 136 seasons of 30+ HRs by CFs, including 3 (by 2 different players) for a team that was born in 1998.
First time in 37 career starts that Tillman has gone 8+ IP with no earned runs. Actually, it’s the first time he’s gone 8+ IP, period. He’s the 5th pitcher this year (and the first since April 9) to go at least 8.1 IP in his first outing.
14th game this year that Seattle had 4 hits or less, 2 more than any other team.
There aren’t many negatives for Jim Johnson this year, but he has let in all 4 inherited runners. The known record for letting in all inherited runners is 9, last done by Mark Thompson in 1995. Johnson has yielded just 3 hits with RISP this year, and 2 of them came with inherited RISP.
At his present rate of losses (11 in 17 starts), Hector Noesi needs just 14 more starts to become the first 20-game loser in Mariners history.

@Nationals 9, Giants 4:

Madison Bumgarner fanned 7 in 5 IP, but a trio of 2-strike counts in the 4th and 5th led to HRs, and he failed to go 6+ IP for the first time since his season debut.
At this pace, Bumgarner will easily become the first pitcher with two seasons of 200+ IP by age 22 since (hide your eyes, SF fans) Steve Avery in 1991-92. He would also be the first age 22 or under to lead the league in IP since Dwight Gooden in 1985. One more: He would be the first ever with 2 qualifying seasons of 4+ SO/BB by age 22; only 4 pitchers have even 1 such year.
Not easy to build a hitting streak as a backup catcher, but Washington’s Jhonatan Solano has hit in 7 straight games out of 8 starts this year, never starting more than once in a 3-day span. He’s 11 for 28 thus far, 2 HRs, 3 doubles. There is nothing in his charts to suggest that he’s a good hitter.
Solano had the 7th catcher-game this year with both a HR and a SB, by 7 different guys. There were just 4 such games all last year, 6 in 2010.
There are 28 relievers with 25+ IP and a sub-2 ERA. The Nats have 4, the Orioles 3, five teams have 2, eleven have 1, and twelve have none.
Sure, I think David Wright should have been the starting All-Star 3B. But it’s no travesty to pick a guy who’s having a fine year and leads Wright in WAR since 2009.
Mark DeRosa has 5 hits in 44 ABs … and 10 walks, none intentional.

Padres 8, @Diamondbacks 6: That’s 5 straight wins for San Diego (and 13 of their last 22), who hadn’t won more than 3 in a row through June. Their last 6-game win streak was in April 2010.

Chris Denorfia (5-3-4-0) has two of the seven 4-hit games by a Padre this year, and he leads the team in BA (.306), OPS and OPS+ (128) while playing errorless defense — all for a salary of just over $1 million.
In 5 starts since Stephen Drew‘s return, displaced SS Willie Bloomquist is 9 for 23 with 6 Runs.
Huston Street has converted all 13 save chances, and has a 0.64 WHIP and 1.23 ERA in 22 IP. The Padres got him at a net salary cost of $7 million for 1 year, to replace Heath Bell, who signed with Miami for 3 years at $9 million. Street is 6 years younger, has better career rate stats than Bell across the board, and had a higher K rate last year. Guess who’s winning the swap so far?
In a very strong year for CFs, Chris Young stands out in a bad way. His 87 OPS+ ranks 23rd among the 34 CFs with at least 150 PAs.

@Blue Jays 4, Royals 1: Toronto advanced 6 bases on flyball outs, including 3 sac flies. Casey Janssen has converted all 11 of his 9th-inning save chances without allowing a run.

Could a team stay within a 6-game range of the .500 mark for a whole season? The Jays are halfway there; they haven’t been lower than 1 game under .500, nor higher than 5 games over (and the last time they got to +5, they lost 5 straight).
Last 40 games for Colby Rasmus: .302/.956, 35 RBI, 31 Runs.
14th multi-hit game for Jose Bautista this year, just the 3rd without a HR.
Darren Oliver is one of the best old relievers in history. Out of 40 relievers with 250+ IP from age 37 onward, Oliver’s 177 OPS+ is 2nd only to The Great Mariano. And he’s on track to be just the 2nd with 5 seasons of 50+ IP and an ERA below 3 from age 37 onward; Hoyt Wilhelm had 9 such years, and Oliver, Mariano, and Trevor Hoffman 4 apiece.

Cubs 5, @Braves 1: Bryan LaHair broke a tie in the 4th with his first HR in 12 games, Alfonso Soriano preserved the lead with a great throw, and Jeff “Home Run” Baker hit his 2nd pinch-HR in 10 ABs this year, as Chicago claimed their 7th win in 9 games, allowing 8 runs total in the 7 wins (and 27 in the 2 losses).

Hot & cold running starter: In his first 2 starts this year, Paul Maholm allowed 6 runs in 4 IP each time. Then came a 4-game win streak with a 1.07 ERA, an 8-start winless stretch with a 6.43 ERA, and now 2 straight wins allowing 1 total run. The totals: In his 6 wins, 4 runs in 39.2 IP (0.91 ERA). In his 6 losses, 32 runs in 27 IP (10.33 ERA).
Anthony Rizzo (10 for 31, 3 HRs) already has more hits in 8 games this year than he did in his last 31 games (20 starts) of 2011, and more HRs in 32 PAs than he hit in 153 PAs last year.
LaHair is hitting .341/1.018 with the bases clear, but .167/.573 with RISP.
Andrelton Simmons (.311 BA, 121 OPS+) has reached safely in 19 of his 22 games with 4+ PA, and (please hold your fire!) his dWAR rating is off the charts — 1.7 dWAR, 4th among all shortstops in less than half the games of the other contenders. His range factor and DP rate are oustanding.

____________________

@White Sox 5, Rangers 4 (10): One day after swatting his first HR in his new stockings, Kevin Youkilis got his first game-winning hit in almost 2 years. Mike Adams had 6 chances to get strike 3 on Alejandro De Aza leading off, but walked him, and 7 tries for strike 3 on Youk, whose single was decisive after De Aza stole second.

In his 2nd and 3rd career games, A.J. Griffin has held the AL’s top 2 offenses to totals of 2 runs (1 ER) on 5 hits over 12 innings. Griffin and teammate Jarrod Parker are the only pitchers in 2011-12 to start their careers with 3 straight games of 6+ IP and 2 runs or less. But Griffin has yet to get a decision.
I’s a good year so far for the A.J. battery. There are 5 active players known by those initials; besides Griffin, A.J. Burnett is 9-2, C A.J. Ellis has a .400 OBP and 125 OPS+, and C A.J. Pierzynski is having his best offensive year ever, slugging .524. Only A.J. Pollock has yet to make an impact.
Alex Rios has raised his BA to .317 by going 22 for 46 in his last 11 games (3 HRs, 5 doubles), with 13 runs, 10 RBI — and no walks.

Yankees 4, @Rays 3: New York snapped their 9-game Tropicana skid with a big assist from Kyle Farnsworth, who set fire to a 3-1 lead by walking 4 out of 5 man to start the 8th, and from Robinson Cano, who greeted the next reliever with a 2-run single. That bailed out Boone Logan, who had surrendered a lead for the first time this year on Carlos Pena‘s 2-run HR in the 7th, and foiled David Price‘s bid to become the AL’s first 12-game winner (7 IP, nicked only by Mark Teixeira‘s solo HR).

@Pirates 6, Astros 4: Pittsburgh has won 7 of their last 8 games and 10 of their last 12 series. They’ve averaged 5.65 runs since June began. And now they’re alone in first place for the first time this year.

Andrew McCutchen: .360/.412/.610. Prior qualifying seasons by a Pirate with OBP/SLG at least .400/.600: Brian Giles (1999), Barry Bonds (’92), Ralph Kiner (1947, ’49, ’51), Arky Vaughan (1935).

@Cardinals 4, Rockies 1: Who’s hotter than Matt Holliday? In his last 17 games, he’s 33 for 64 with 19 RBI, 16 Runs and a 1.423 OPS.

31-50 is Colorado’s 3rd-worst first half in club history; they’ve been 28-53 twice.
11th Rockies road game this year with no HRs by either side. There’s been just 1 such game in Coors Field.

Phillies 9, @Mets 2: Our long national nightmare is over: Cliff Lee is winless no more.

This game captures the dilemma for Terry Collins when Chris Young pitches well through 6 IP (today, 0 R, 2 H, 2 BB) — He must know that Young is a 6-inning pitcher; the 3 instant runs in today’s 7th brought his season marks for that frame to 23.16 ERA, .533 BA and 1.200 SLG, and his career 7th-inning ERA to 5.82. On the other hand, the Mets bullpen remains hideous; today’s 6 runs in 2 IP pushed their season ERA to 5.11.
Ty Wigginton has 14 RBI against the Mets (11 for 25, 3 HRs), and 21 RBI vs. everyone else.
Juan Pierre is hitting .500 against the Mets (14 for 28), and .296 vs. everyone else.
How are the new home field dimensions working for the Mets? In 42 home games, they’ve been out-homered by 41-32. Last year they were out-homered 58-50 in 81 home games.

@Dodgers 4, Reds 1: Aaron Harang and 2 relievers combined on a 3-hitter, as LA won consecutive games for the first time since June 9-10 against Seattle.

Cincinnati’s 6-week run atop the division came to an end.

@Tigers 5, Twins 1: Adding to his MLB lead in IP and CG, Justin Verlander went the distance on 4 hits, beating Minnesota for the 6th straight time, and took over the lead in strikeouts.

Austin Jackson and Miguel Cabrera reached safely in all 8 trips. They would be the first Tigers teammates since 1961 with OPS at least .940.
Cabrera (2 HRs, double) scored 3 runs for just the 2nd time this year; he has a .578 OBP in his last 10 games. Of his 18 HRs, 16 have come against righties, and 13 at home.
Jackson’s .957 OPS would be the highest for a Bengal CF since Heinie Manush in 1926.
Since 2009, Verlander leads the majors in IP, SO and Wins. He’s the only Tigers SP with an ERA below 4.35 this year.

Marlins 7, @Brewers 6: One strike away from defeat, Gaby Sanchez tied the game with an opposite-field HR off John Axford. Miami went ahead in the 10th with two more 2-out hits. Milwaukee failed in 3 chances with RISP to win or tie in their last 2 innings,

Just the 3rd HR in 196 PAs this year for Sanchez, who also raised his BA over .200 for the first time since June 11. He was 2 for 42 in high-leverage situations, and 1 for 15 in the 9th or later.
That’s a lotta leverage: 11 of 23 save chances for Heath Bell have started with a 1-run lead (7 saves, 4 blown).

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Angus

11 years ago

GREAT QUESTION: Is Alex Gordon going to set an all-time record for doubles to rbi ratio??? 25 doubles and 26 rbi’s? Sounds like you should investigate Mr. Autin. Love the site, can’t read enough, Angus

Editor

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

Actually, Willie Bloomquist has a higher ratio than Gordon this year, with 16 doubles to 12 RBI. His is one of 7 (so far) qualifying seasons with doubles 20% or more above RBI.

The largest percentage difference was 47% (25 2B to 17 RBI) by Johnny Cooney in 1938. Largest absolute difference was 11 (36 2B to 25 RBI) by Frank Baumholtz in 1953. Most RBI with more doubles was 51 RBI and 54 2B by Mark Grudzielanek in 1997.

mosc

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Grudzielanek had 54 doubles !?!

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Something else about that Grudzielanek season. It’s by far the lowest Rbat (i.e., batting runs) for a season of 50+ doubles. Grudzielanek had a -17 Rbat that year. The only other two negative seasons were Brian Roberts in 2004 (50 doubles, -3 Rbat) and Luis Gonzalez in 2004(52 doubles, -2 Rbat).

Editor

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

Should add that Eric Young is the only player with two qualifying seasons with more doubles than RBI (min. 10 RBI), 43/42 in 2001 and 29/28 in 2002.

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

speaking of doubles, Votto hit #34 yesterday, he’s at 34-47

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

actually, I just saw the 43-42 comment above, that’s a crazy stat

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

another thing on Eric Young, he had a fairly productive career for someone who “only” made 29 mil

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to Angus

I know it’s only a partial season, but in 2002 Cliff Floyd had 21 doubles (and 7 HR) in 47 games for the Red Sox, but only 18 RBI. It seemed like his whole time w/the Red Sox, Floyd was cranking out XBH, but not knocking that many runs in.

Editor

Doug

11 years ago

In the Jays 4-1 win over the Royals, Toronto`s 4 runs came on 3 sac flies and a tally manufactured by a leadoff single by Colby Rasmus, advancement to 3rd on two deep flies, and an RBI single by Yunel Escobar. It was only the 5th time in Blue Jays history scoring 4 runs or less in a game with 3 or more sac flies, but the 2nd time in as many years. Since sac flies started being recorded, teams have scored all their runs on 3 sac flies only 23 times, and on 4 sac flies just once (MON… Read more »

Daniel Longmire

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Doug, it was an interesting game to listen to, then watch the highlights of after I got home. Tonight I discovered something I never knew before that made me curious: why is the batter not credited with a sacrifice fly when a runner or runners advance to another base, but IS given credit when the runner scores? A sacrifice bunt is granted by the scorer whenever the runner(s) move up a base. Now, people may argue that the bunt is an intentional play by the batter to “give himself up”, but I don’t see how hitting a deep fly ball… Read more »

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Daniel Longmire

That’s the way the rules are. The thinking is probably that advancement to home, because of the long throw from the outfield, is the only play where a batter can reasonably expect to advance most runners with a medium to deep fly ball. Hence, with a runner at third, it is more reasonable to assume intentionality (is that a word?) by the batter by swinging in a manner to promote “lifting” the ball into the outfield. Thus, sac flies are awarded only on advancements to home. As was seen in tonight’s game, both advancements by Rasmus in the 7th inning… Read more »

Daniel Longmire

11 years ago

Reply to Doug

Those are all valid reasons; I just find it to be an inconsistent application of the rules. Either mark both plays the same way you would for advancement on a fielder’s choice (0 for 1), or make each of them a sacrifice hit and consider it an unofficial at-bat. Sticking out a bat and nudging the ball 30 feet seems far less impressive to me than guiding the ball 300 feet to right-centre. Off-topic, as a Jays fan, I’m liking Rasmus more every day. His baseball IQ appears very high, and his skills are multi-dimensional and only improving. The front… Read more »

11 years ago

Reply to Daniel Longmire

Daniel – I agree with your comments. It’s one of the things that bothers me about fans who espouse batting average as some sort of sacrosanct statistic while denouncing/ridiculing advanced stats. The truth is that there are a lot of decisions that go into deciding what’s an out and what isn’t and those decisions effect batting average. A ground ball the scores a run is on out but a fly ball isn’t. Why? They both accomplished the same thing. Or why isn’t a batter given two outs for grounding into a double play?

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Daniel Longmire

Ed @12 — And let’s not forget the silliness of denying an RBI on a GIDP. That must have been the brainstorm of an “RBI-are-all-I-know-and-all-that-matters” curmudgeon. For anyone aware of more than the elemental stats, the counting of a GIDP on the batter’s stat sheet is “punishment” enough. And there are times, like the top of the 9th in a tie game, facing a high-strikeout pitcher, when a GIDP that brings in the run is a perfectly satisfactory outcome.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Daniel Longmire

From 1925 to 1930 the rule was that a batter is credited with a sacrifice for advancing a base runner on a fly ball regardless of to which base the runner advanced.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

This is a very useful data point when comparing batting averages of different eras. Six of the 11 highest BA’s for all of MLB in the 20th century were the six seasons from 1925 to 1930. Of course, almost all of that is the offensive context, but counting more base-advancing flies as not being official at bats helped a little, also. Did Hornsby in 1925 (.403) and Terry in 1930 (.401) hit .400 because of this rule? Would Carew in 1977 (.388) or Brett in 1980 (.390) have hit .400 with this scoring rule in effect? Inquiring minds want to… Read more »

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

LA: It looks like 6 of the top 22 highest BA occurred from 1925 to 1930. From 1926 to 1930 4 of the top 22 BA occurred.

In 1930 Terry hit .401 with 254 hits in 633 AB. If you assume all of his 19 SH were fly balls his average would be .390.

From 1926 to 1930 Gehrig had 85 SH and for the rest of his career he had 8.

Richard Chester

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

I did some more research on that SF rule. It seems that the rule was in effect from 1926 to 1930.

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

This article gives the long, sodid history of the sacrifice fly. While the current rule has been in place starting with the 1954 season, prior to that, the rule was changed repeatedly. A quick recap of how the rules has changed, beginning with 1990:

1900-1907: No sac flies, not even for scoring plays
1908-1925: Scoring sac fly only
1926-1930: As noted by Richard, all fly balls that advance a runner counted as a sac fly
1931-1938: No sac flies, not even for scoring plays
1939: Scoring sac flies only
1940-1953: No sac flie, not even for scoring plays

http://research.sabr.org/journals/sacrifice-fly

Daniel Longmire

11 years ago

Reply to Richard Chester

Thanks for the research, Richard and Ed. I had no idea the concept of a sac fly even existed before ’54; that is an INSANE number of changes to the rule. And John, I think any team would gladly exchange two outs for one run in any situation, except perhaps bases loaded with none out. Why not have a GIDP RBI? You can have a sac fly where a runner is also gunned down trying for second or third, and it still counts as a run batted in. It’s ludicrous.

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

I’m disappointed Juan Pierre did not make the all-star team. It would have been nice if he’d made the first of his career.

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

Perhaps he should take up the knuckleball. It’s not too late.

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

And who would you have left off to make room for Pierre?

Doug

11 years ago

There was an unusual sequence of plays in the Yankees/Rays game today. In the Yankee 7th, with A-Rod on 2nd and Swisher on 1st, during a timeout on the field, A-Rod walked over to first and engaged Swisher in conversation. Ken Singleton on YES speculated that A-Rod may have been alerting Swisher of his intention to steal 3rd, and urging Swisher to take advantage and also move up a base. Sure enough, a pitch or two later, Alex did steal 3rd and, looking back to find Swisher, made quite an animated display of frustration in seeing Nick still at first.… Read more »

11 years ago

The Indians pounded Ervin Santana for 8 runs in 1.1 innings yesterday, dropping his career totals against the Tribe to a 1-8 record with a 5.03 ERA. His one victory….the no-hitter he threw against them last year!

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Ed

And in the 3 games in which Derek Lowe has allowed 11+ hits (total of 13 ER in 17.2 IP), his record is 2-0 and the team’s 3-0.

Lowe’s rate of 3.01 SO/9 would be the lowest by a qualifier since 2004 … except that Henderson Alvarez is even lower this year (2.82).

It would be fun to see those two matched up. Cleveland and Toronto have a series next weekend, but rotations are impossible to predict because of the All-Star break.

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Had never heard of Henderson Alvarez before but how does someone go from 5.7 SO/9 to 2.8 at age 22? Last year he had 4 or more strikeouts in 7 of 10 starts (70%). This year it’s 1 of 16 (6.7%)!!! Meanwhile, his walk rate has nearly doubled from a year ago (1.1 to 1.9) and his home runs allowed are also up (1.1 to 1.5). And yet his ERA+ has only slipped from 122 to 103. Weird. Still, it’s hard to see how he can be successful long-term if those sort of trends continue.

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Ed

It seems to this observer that Alvarez has some maturing to do. He has frequently had problems getting on the same page with his catcher. I recall one game where, after a mound conference with Arencibia, he gave up a late HR with men on, throwing some kind of lollipop pitch right in the batter’s wheelhouse. After the play, Arencibia glared at him and Alvarez just kind of shrugged his shoulders, as if to say “Well, that’s what you said you wanted me to throw”. When the inning ended, the two had a heated exchange in the dugout. Not sure… Read more »

Evan

11 years ago

The Cardinals turned the uncommon 3-6-5 double play without an overrun of third or a shift yesterday:

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=22847039&c_id=mlv

It actually would have been easier to turn the unusual 3-5-6 double play instead.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Evan

Thanks for the video link, Evan.

If I were writing the rules, I would make it so that the force play is removed when a batted ball strikes an infielder’s glove on the fly. That would be consistent with the tag-up rule, i.e., as soon as a fielder touches a fly ball, the runner can tag up and try to advance, even if the fielder winds up juggling the ball before catching it.

There’s no reason for the defense to benefit from their own failure to make a clean catch, whether the drop is intentional or not.

Evan

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

So the fielders would be required to physically tag the runner not just simply step on the base? It seems like this would create some inequitable results and excessive tag plays, such as when the pitcher knocks down a liner up the middle. Would you allow the defense to have one force out, a force out at 1st, but not other bases? I’m not sure your rule helps them in this situation as both runners were forced to hold up not knowing if the ball would be caught – clearly they still need to run if the ball isn’t caught… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Evan

Evan, here’s how I’m thinking through this issue: First principle — The rules should not create an incentive for dishonesty. Second principle — As much as possible, the rules should promote (not penalize) smart play. The main purpose of my rule would be to prevent inequitable double plays, such as the one that happened in the video. I find it inequitable because it penalized proper baserunning. Runners are taught to hold up on a line drive with less than 2 out, to avoid being doubled off if it is caught. The defense shouldn’t find a benefit in dropping the ball,… Read more »

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

It’s still kind of a grey area as Evan points out in #22 above.

Unless the batter is deemed automatically out if the umpire rules the ball should have been caught. In other words, an extension of the infield fly rule, except invoked after the fact rather than before. That would take some getting used to.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

#27/ Ed –
Supposedly,the sacrifice rule was created after the 1907 season, when the Phillies manager (Billy Murray) noted that his star right fielder Sherry Magee had the facility of often producing a long run-producing fly ball whenever there was runner on third and less than two out.

Looking at his yearly SH totals, there does seem to be quite a jump from his first four seasons of 1904-07, and the rest of Magee’s career.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

#29/ Richard –

Should’ve made this clearer: I meant the BA FOR ALL OF MLB for the years 1925-1930, not the BA for individual players.

As for Terry – I’m guessing that a hitter of Terry’s stature wasn’t called upon to lay one down for the good of the team very often. But with McGraw as manager and in-game strategies being quite different from today, who knows. If even two of those SHs in 1930 were non run-scoring fly balls that merely advanced runners, then he would not have batted .400 by today’s scoring rules.

Doug

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

You would probably be surprised then to know that Terry had 85 sacrifices for 1925-30, with a minimum of 17 each year for 1927-30. Ironically, those last four seasons with all the sacrifices, Terry slugged over .500 every year, but was under .500 in 1925-26 when he had “just” 12 sacrifices total. The notion of sacrificing being a “noble act” for every player to aspire to was evidently still prevalent even as late as the late 20s. The pattern made more sense after that, with just 12 sacrifices total in 1931-33, then quickly surged up to 35 for 1934-35 when… Read more »

11 years ago

Even as a Giants fan who is happy to see Panda starting the ASG, I think fan voting is stupid.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to RJ

Trust me, RJ, the players didn’t do any better than the fans when they had the vote.

It’s an exhibition, so I say let the fans see whom they choose. I don’t like the way teams promote fans voting for their home players nor the fact that someone can vote 25(?) times, but I can’t get worked up over Wright not being voted in when he’ll still be on the team.

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

RJ, I’m in the same boat. Dan Uggla starting at second base, while I’m happy for him, is a bit embarrassing. He’s fallen off a cliff recently at the plate. So instead of bitching and whining about no Braves outfielder on the squad(but Jay Bruce(?) is), I’m keeping my mouth shut about it since Uggla’s in.

11 years ago

Reply to bstar

Solution: John Autin picks the team!

Seriously though, Brandon Crawford, he of the .242/.289/.339 slash and the 79 OPS+, came SECOND in the shortstop vote, 300,000 votes behind Rafael Furcal. Brandon Belt (decent but not great) is also seemingly the second best first baseman in the National League.

My annoyance at seeing the excellent Ryan Vogelsong not be selected is offset by my relief at these two not being the NL starters.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

There’s a fundamental contradiction at work here; we still call the MLB All-Star game an “exhibition”, yet the result is now used to determine the home-field advantage of the World Series that year. Sorry, but “exhibitions” should _not_ factor in determining the results of the MLB championship season. Since the MLB AS game is now more than a mere “exhibition”, perhaps MLB should: – take the voting for the starters away from the fans, and select a team that would actually give each league the best chance to win – have starting pitchers go 3/4 innings, instead of 1/2 innings… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

Lawrence, I agree that the linkage Bud created between the ASG winner and the WS home advantage is stupid. Exhibitions shouldn’t “count” for anything in the real race. But the chain of cause and effect from who is elected an ASG starter to which team actually wins the WS is, in my opinion, so vaporous as to be not worth a moment’s thought. Consider the well-known fact that signing a star free-agent is usually worth no more than 3 to 5 wins to a team over a full season. Now we’re talking about one game, a game in which virtually… Read more »

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

John A., I understand your basic point,that either the method of player selection to the AS game, or the sprcific strategies used, usually do not determine whether the AL or NL wins a particular AS game. HOWEVER, I have a larger philosophical point: Since the AS game now _does_ determine WS HFA, stop treating it otherwise as an exhibition. If you really care about who wins and loses the AS game, stop picking a zillion players, and doing your best to play them all. It really wouldn’t be that hard; just go back to the way the AS game was… Read more »

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Good on Reggie Jackson! Too bad he hedged on Andy Pettitte though.

Jason Z

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

I just read the article in SI. Jackson beyond the steroid comments, said that Kirby Puckett, Gary Carter, Jim Rice and Bert “be home” Blyleven should not be in the HOF. He added that Jack Morris deserves
it over Bert as he was the dominant pitcher of the era.

BTW, that was a nice bunt by Juan Pierre. It always amazes me how few
players really know how to bunt.

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

Jackson didn’t actually say Morris should be in the Hall. Just that he was the dominant pitcher of his era. One could read between the lines, but I’d hate for someone to do that to me.

BTW, he also listed Phil Niekro and Don Sutton as guys that shouldn’t be in the Hall.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Ed

My dad used to rail against putting a .262 hitter in the Hall of Fame. I always defended Reggie’s belonging, and I still would. But these opinions are disappointing.

BTW, Reggie had a single in 17 ABs against Phil Niekro near the ends of their careers. Reggie faced Blyleven more than any other pitcher, and Bert struck him out 49 times in 140 PAs (35%), with slashes of .214/.264/.397. I wouldn’t say “sour grapes” necessarily, but it sure does smell bad.

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

You know, with Reggie it really might be sour grapes. He has a fire about him that doesn’t sound like it’s diminished much since he played. I like that he said Hank Aaron is still the HR king.

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Apparently Reggie’s beef with Gary Carter is he didn’t believe lifetime .262 hitters like Carter should be in the HOF. Oh, wait…

For the record, I maybe one of the few people who actually think Reggie Jackson was underrated.

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

There is a lot that Reggie said I don’t agree with, like Puckett not being in the HoF. But you can have discussions and disagreements about Puckett, Morris, and be confident that their stats speak for themselves. Can’t say that about ARod, Sosa, and Palmiero because you just don’t know.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

I thought that there was some sort of informal agreement amongst the “Fraternity Of MLB HOF Players” not to publicly question if any of them are actually worthy of being in the HOF. Reggie’s statements seem to be a fairly serious breach of that philosophy.

Can anyone remember another HOF player making sinilar statements? I can’t.

Than again, mebbe it’s just “Reggie! being Reggie!”, still being the straw that stirs the drink, not giving a $h!% what anyone else thinks of his opinions…

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

The comments by Jackson show to me why letting ex-players decide who gets in the HOF is, and always has been, a bad idea. I think a good portion of the really questionable HOF selections have been by the Veterans Committee. For Jackson to not have an understanding that Blyleven and Jack Morris didn’t really pitch in the same era is scary to me(Blyleven had over 100 wins before Morris debuted in 1977). His perspective on Sutton and especially Niekro is scary bad as well. I agree with him about Puckett and Rice but that’s it.

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to bstar

Reggie’s a Jack Morris fan! (Sound of me giggling) hehe

Jason Z

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

I think if Reggie is a Jack Morris fan, and his comments support that, it probably came to
fruition toward the end of Jack’s career when
he won those two more rings and pitched that epic game seven against Smoltz.

Reggie aka Mr. October probably became a Morris
fan at the end of his career and specifically after game seven in 91. Of course if he likes postseason heroics, has he forgotten Puckett’s homer in game six?

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

Reggie’s all over the place with his HoF thoughts.

11 years ago

Reply to bstar

I was thinking the same thing re: Blyleven vs. Morris. Another thing…Gary Carter played his entire career in the NL, Reggie in the AL. So how does Reggie know that Gary wasn’t a HOFer???

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to Ed

And if Reggie is using “best pitcher of his era” to praise Jack Morris, how in the world is Gary Carter not the best catcher of his era? I don’t really consider he and Johnny Bench contemporaries. Bench’s heyday was the early 70s and Carter didn’t debut til ’74.

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to bstar

Bstar – Agreed; although there’s been a few questionable BBWAA (writers) choices (Dean, Hunter, Perez, Sutter, Rice), all of the worst HOF selections were by the Old-timers Veterans Committees. In particular, there’s the cluster of six to ten players known as the Friends of Frankie Frisch, the ones chosen in the 1970s when Frisch was highly influencial with the Veterans Committee: -Dave Bancroft -Travis Jackson -Jesse Haines -Ross Youngs and four of the very very worst HOF selections: -George “High Pockets” Kelly -Freddie Lindstrom -Chick Hafey -Rube Marquard None of the writers choices have come close to being as bad… Read more »

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to Lawrence Azrin

Wow! I looked some of the guys up and you’re right. Travis Jackson might be best of the lot, and maybe you can try to put in context the era and all, but still. Bancroft played for the great Giants teams of ’21, ’22, and ’23. Maybe taking the era into consideration for him helps too, but more than likely it’s thanks to Frisch as you say.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

I see that Reggie is now apologizing for some of his comments to SI:
http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/8136799/officials-reggie-jackson-apologizing-criticism-alex-rodriguez

Unfortunately, what he’s apologizing for is NOT his apparently seat-of-the-pants judgments about HOFers who don’t belong, but his utterly reasonable remark about A-Rod: “I think there are real questions about his numbers. As much as I like him, what he admitted about his usage does cloud some of his records.”

I understand why the apology is necessary, politically, for someone in the role of Yankees special adviser. But it’s a very sad day for reason and independent thought.

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Reason and independent thought? Are we talking about the same Reggie here?!

Jimbo

11 years ago

Oliver’s ERA has gone down each year from age 37-41! Going from good to better to great.

MikeD

11 years ago

I wonder what got into Reggie when he gave this interview? I guess he hasn’t mellowed that much even in his mid-60s and can still tap into the spirit of “I’m the straw that stirs the drink” when talking to the press. When I read this I didn’t know where to begin. So many statements, so many things I disagreed with, yet even some I didn’t disagree with. No consistency in his thoughts. I can’t wait for the annual HOF dinner when he’s sitting there with Blyleven, Sutton, Rice, Neikro and others who he doesn’t think belongs. “So Reggie, you… Read more »

Jim Bouldin

11 years ago

For the record I think the very idea of a Hall of Fame is a fairly backward idea to begin with.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Jim Bouldin

That’s great, Jim — my posts haven’t crossed the 100-comment barrier in a while. 🙂

Jim Bouldin

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Glad to help out John.

Oh and I forgot to add that baseball should be understood through statistical analysis only. We need more data, more graphs, more acronyms, more math, more computations, more calculators, MORE NUMBERS!. Indeed, all games should be simulated; no need to actually play all these things…

no statistician but

11 years ago

Reply to Jim Bouldin

Jim Boudin, Jim Boudin, he was a bold, adventurin’ man.

(Maybe not old enough to catch the reference, but at least he has thrown down the gauntlet.)

Thanks, Jim.

no statistician but

11 years ago

Reply to no statistician but

Actually Bouldin,. Sorry.

tag

11 years ago

Reply to Jim Bouldin

Jim, this is the sanest comment I’ve read. I’ve never understood the obsession with halls of fame. I’m all for a baseball museum, one that traces the history of the game, mentions the great players and singles out the memorable events, but this notion of enshrinement… Yes, the Hall of Fame exists, fine, but I’ve always thought it was best treated like, say, the Belgian monarchy. New princes and princesses are born every so often, adding to and extending it, and maybe every now and then someone writes a feature story about them / it, but that’s the extent of… Read more »

e pluribus munu

11 years ago

Reply to tag

I strongly object to this line of thinking. It implies a type of maturity in baseball fans that would exclude me.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to tag

I can honestly say, this is the first time that I’ve ever thought about the rationale for having a HOF.

As a purely practical matter, even though I’ve been able to reach a sort of apathy towards the All-Star Game, I’m not sure I could do the same about the Hall as long as it continues to occupy such a prominent place in the baseball firmament.

But I do see that the question deserves to be pondered. So, thanks for bringing it up.

Thomas Court

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Yeah… I feel the same way about the All-Star game. Which makes me wonder why I have become apathetic about it when it was so important to me growing up. The Hall is still THE Hall… but questions regarding why we as fans think it is so important are really going to need an answer when certain candidates start becoming eligible. Trenches are going to be dug – with one side adamant about keeping certain players out, and the other insisting on induction. It will be those on the outside that ask, “Why is it so important to begin with?”… Read more »

tag

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

Well, Thomas, my argument would be that for a long time in the history of western civ monarchies were, um, kind of important but we “matured” past that by developing various forms of democracy, and thank god. (Only the UK, one of the greatest democracies, is a little backward in regard to their thinking on monarchy.) Maybe we just need to get a little more forward thinking on this subject, and let Jim write our Magna Carta / be our Wilhelm Tell 🙂 As I said above, we should be moving in the direction of a great baseball museum, a… Read more »

no statistician but

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

Concerning the All-Star game, I think what has happened is that with the proliferation of franchises and the virtual doubling of numbers of players eligible, there has come an inevitable confusion of too many choices, too many players with good credentials one has barely heard of, not enough interest in too many of the guys who finally make the team. League loyalty, too, has diminished, I suspect. I used to be an American Leaguer all the way, but with the breakdown into multiple divisions and the introduction of inter-league play, free agency shifting star players around like chess pieces in… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

@113 nsb — I think you’re exactly right with all of that. So I just got an idea: Each league makes 2 All-Star team, one chosen by the fans, the other by the managers. Rosters would be shorter. Extend the break by one day; some teams already get Thursday off, so the schedule shouldn’t be a big problem. On Tuesday, the league teams play off, two 7-inning games (like amateur doubleheaders). The league winners go on to the AL-NL game on Wednesday. This format would: (a) preserve the fan voting, while giving the “objectively deserving” a better shot and exploiting… Read more »

Nash Bruce

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

um, ya, sounds good John, but many players would be selected by both the managers and the fans……how to resolve that???

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

@118 Nash Bruce – I’d say fan voting would take precedence; the manager can take what’s left. With shorter rosters this shouldn’t create too much of an imbalance. Or maybe the right to first pick alternates year on year somehow?

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

@118 Nash — What RJ said @119 is what I had in mind — the fans get first pick, the managers get the leftovers. I think the teams would be fairly balanced.

Thomas Court

11 years ago

I am with BStar on this one. Former players should not have a say on what players are voted in. Their perspectives are too skewed and more importantly too limited. It’s the same reason why college football coaches should not have a vote on weekly team rankings. Are they really supposed to prepare their teams to play each week AND evaluate every other team in the country? NO. Sportswriters are not perfect either, since many of them will hold personal grudges against Hall of Fame candidates when voting time comes around. But at least writers have a better perspective on… Read more »

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

I agree it would have been interesting to see how a healthy Chavez’s career would have played out. He was still pretty young when he got hurt and was racking up Gold Gloves even after A-rod moved to 3rd. However, at his peak he had a reputation of being “un-clutch”, I seem to remember his baseball reference page around that time was always sponsored by someone pointing that out. He was overshadowed by Giambi , The Big Three, & Tejeda but Oakland chose to sign him for the long term based on his age & what they felt he could… Read more »

Paul E

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

TC @ 58 & Tubbs – 59:
Just wondering if you fellows believe Chavez was the superior of Rolen – talent wise. Just curious….I just believe Rolen would have put up 400+ hr’S/2,500 hits, etc… without back problems (early Phillies years) and twice getting run over in the baseline (Cardinals0 necessitating surgeries

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to Paul E

I’m not TC or Tubbs, nor do I play them on TV or the Internet, but prior to Chavez’s back injuries, I’d rate them as roughly equivalent type hitters, although Rolen slightly ahead. A slightly better hitter, slightly better fielder, slightly better foot speed, etc. Injuries have held back both players, with Chavez suffering the most. A case can be made that Rolen is a HOFer by past third basemen elected to the Hall. Yet he’s not going to get in. Another in the list of 3B’man who will sit on the wrong side of the borderline HOFer debate. Chavez… Read more »

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to MikeD

Can we keep this thread going all year? 200, 300, 400 posts?! I meant to post this article the other day when the mini-Eric Chavez discussion broke out, so I’ll drop it in here now. Since I’m in NY, I get to see Chavez play and I have to say every time I see him walk to the plate I legitimately worry about him. When he was having multiple back surgeries with the A’s, I was rooting he could make it back, but I mostly wished he just retired. I remember a quote from a doctor saying that Chavez’s injuries… Read more »

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to Paul E

Through their age 29 season Chavez (98-07) had 32.9 WAR while Rolen (96-04) checked in at 44.1. Chavez wasn’t as good at drawing walks as Rolen so that hurt his OBP but was Improving as he had lead AL in walks in ’04. Chavez was a bit of supporting star to Giambi & Tejeda while Rolen was viewed in a little higher light. I’d give Rolen the edge talent wise. He’ll make a great HOF argument when he retires. Funny thing is him, Schilling, & Abreu all are borderline HOFers (although I don’t see how you can keep Schilling out)… Read more »

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to Tubbs

Re: Schilling. Douchebaggery? I guess that hasn’t be a reason in the past, so probaby won’t be now! : -)

Mike L

11 years ago

Reply to MikeD

Schilling has a small present issue with a large defaulted bond obligation for his now defunct business that the State of Rhode Island will be paying on his behalf. Doesn’t change his accomplishments on the field, but might take a little sheen off the gentleman’s halo.

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to MikeD

I’ll be the first to admit that while I never cared for Schill–all the way back to the ’93 postseason–I think his excellent postseason record puts him over the top. Additionally, he passed 3,000 strike outs so while his current legal issues & being on a crowded will keep his vote totals low at first, I don’t see how you can keep him out of the HOF

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to MikeD

In defense of Curt Schilling: He’s a loud mouth, and not a very good businessman. But, he lost his money as well as the RI taxpayers money. There are ways to operate a company without putting everything you’ve ever earned at risk, and Schilling should have done that. Schilling is now as poor as you and I, and his past political stances are coming back to haunt him in his quest for a financial comeback. The difference between being a really good athlete, and being a crack businessman has shown itself in the Schilling matter without a doubt. Having said… Read more »

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to MikeD

Schilling will rebound. He’s a bigmouth but actually pretty well spoken, articulate, & not afraid to state his opinions. I don’t believe he’s written an autobiography but with his candidness he would have a lot to say in a book. Though I never liked him, I did respect how outspoken he was about steroids. He wasn’t the most popular with a lot of teammates, I remember one of his nicknames was “Red Light” since he loved the camera

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Thomas Court

Thomas, I think Chavez through age 27 was roughly 50/50 for the Hall, based solely on comparison to those who came before him. I used age 27 for two reasons: (a) It was his last very good year (4.5 WAR, no later year worth more than 2.5); and (b) While he’d compare even better using an age-26 cutoff, it would seem foolish to omit the most common peak age. Through age 27, Chavez had amassed 28.5 WAR. I then searched for two sets of inactive position players through age 27: (1) Those with at least 27 WAR who are not… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

I’ll add that Chavez through 27 had a lot in common with Buddy Bell, including their WAR totals: 28.5 for Chavez, 29.1 for Bell. Both were good on both sides of the ball, but were overshadowed by bigger stars at the position; Bell had made one AS team (age 21), Chavez none. So what’s my point? Bell continued at a very high level for another 5 years, compiling 27.9 WAR from age 28-32, winning the Gold Glove each year. He had a couple more decent years after that, and finished with a healthy 61.6 WAR. Buddy Bell appeared on the… Read more »

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

I don’t think Bell gets enough credit, his yrs in Texas were amazing, he was at his best at the plate & in the field as a Ranger. He won all those Gold Gloves w/the popular Brett & Nettles as competition. Hard to believe he didnt even come close to 5% of the vote. Even after Santo’s overdue election, 3rd base is sparse on HOFers. Rolen will be very borderline & could be a Santo type on the Vet Comm ballot. Bell deserves a longer look. I would be okay with Bell, Nettles, Darrell Evans, or one of the other… Read more »

Timmy Pea

11 years ago

I think Reggie reads HHS and understands the HoF battles being waged!

Nash Bruce

11 years ago

Reply to Timmy Pea

All of this talk of Reggie and deserving HOF candidates got me digging through some of B-Ref’s player pages. Yow! Dale Murphy had more gray and(!)black ink than an average HOF…..short period of dominance be damned.
And, in the spirit of All-Star balloting, he IS a personal favorite of mine 😀

Jason Z

11 years ago

Reply to Nash Bruce

I agree with Dale Murphy. He was arguably the best player
in his league (or second behind Mike Schmidt) from about
1982-87. I realize that is short, but when you are the
best player in your league for that length of time, you
should be in.

no statistician but

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

I don’t have feelings about Dale Murphy particularly, but the comments on Eric Chavez above stirred a thought I’ve often had about players whose careers are severely shortened or diminished by injury or illness. Beyond the tragedies of people like Addie Joss and Ross Youngs, you have those such as George Sisler, and to a lesser degree Chuck Klein, who never returned to their previous level of dominance, Sandy Koufax, who retired rather than suffer, and Kirby Puckett, who surely had several good years left in him when the eye ailment struck. All of these players have been voted into… Read more »

birtelcom

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

For what it’s worth, Murphy had the the fourth most Wins Above Replacement(b-ref version) in the NL over the period 1982-1987:
1. Mike Schmidt 36.8
2. Tim Raines 34.1
3. Gary Carter 33.0
4. Dale Murphy 32.3
5. Ozzie Smith 30.7

The Fangraphs version of WAR has the same top 4 in the same order:
1. Schmidt 39.0
2. Raines 36.5
3. Carter 34.8
4. Murphy 33.4
5. Keith Hernandez 30.9

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

When it comes to the HOF, I value peak more than the very good player who is a career compiler, yet ideally the HOF candidate would have both. I’ll spend more time analyzing the cases of players like Murphy and Mattingly than I will the Lou Whitaker types. The HOF is about marketing the game and its history, and of course rewarding greatness. Yet any player who can claim he was the best overall, or in the top few for a four or five year period will get more serious consideration from me than they would have in the past.… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

I’ll make a case against Dale Murphy: 1. Short career for a HOFer (2,180 games) — 26 HOF position players with all or almost all of their career in the expansion era played more games than Murphy. The only HOFers with all or virtually of their careers in that era and fewer games than Murphy were Puckett, Jim Rice, Johnny Bench (catchers have a separate G standard), and Ryne Sandberg (2Bs have shorter careers than OFs). Barry Larkin had the same number of games as Murphy. 2. Home park boosted his stats — Murphy was a .250 hitter away from… Read more »

Mike L

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

I’ll side with John A. @80. Murphy’s stats oddly resemble Mattingly’s, with a highly valued short term peak that was certainly excellent, but not off the charts, and then a descent into just about league average. I really liked both players, but neither is Hall-worthy. If you look at other players who had shorter careers and five or six year peaks and made the Hall, their peaks were higher (like Koufax) or they sustained a high level of play (like Puckett.)

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

Thanks John! You saved me about an hour’s worth of work, typing up an anti-Murphy HOF post. 🙂

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

@80 JA, Dale Murphy was my childhood baseball hero. He’s still probably #2 all-time on my list behind Greg Maddux(although Tim Hudson is seriously pushing Murphy for 2nd place). As much as I want to provide counterpoints to all your issues with Murphy’s career, JA, a lot of what you say is true. I do think pointing out his home/road splits and calling into question his black ink might be a bit much, partly because I’ve never heard anyone bring into question someone like sabermetric darling Dwight Evans and his obvious home-field advantage. I’ve only heard myself point out Wade… Read more »

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

Oh, and to help bring your comment total closer to the 100 threshold(do we all get free pizza if we get there?), JA what is a pp-Hall of Famer?

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

@81 bstar — It’s certainly not my intention to cut down an idol. Dale Murphy was a great player for some years; I think we both agree that he wasn’t great for quite long enough to deserve enshrinement. I made my points about his prime because I think that’s the only argument that can be made for his election, a la Sandy Koufax. I don’t think it’s unfair to bring up extreme home/road splits. I’ll gladly acknowledge that Wade Boggs was a far better hitter in Fenway than elsewhere; his career OPS was about 150 points better at home. Still,… Read more »

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

P.S. My inelegant term “pp-HOFer” meant position player Hall of Famer. I probably didn’t even need to specify “position players,” since we wouldn’t ordinarily compare a CF with a pitcher.

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

JA @89, fair enough. I think we share a pretty similar view of Murphy’s career, actually. I just couldn’t resist giving my two cents worth. And no, you weren’t tearing down an idol. Once I became aware of advanced stats, it became pretty obvious Murph wasn’t as good as I thought at the time, and even if he were his counting stats are just too far away from HOF norms for outfielders anyway. I think longevity has to play a part, too, unless you’re all-time dominant for a shorter career.

Tubbs

11 years ago

Reply to birtelcom

It’s unfortunate for Murphy that he wasn’t able to hang around in Colorado a little longer & hit a couple more home runs & pass 400. Saber stats don’t help Murphy too much but back when he debuted on the HOF ballot back in ’99, counting stats were pretty much all the voters looked at & 400 looks a lot better than 398. Back then only Darrell Evans & Dave Kingman had hit 400+ & not been elected–but they had sub .250BAs where Murphy’s was .265, yet somehow you think of him having a higher career BA. It also hurt… Read more »

Voomo Zanzibar

11 years ago

To add to the earlier conversation regarding sac flies, I don’t think that a batter should be (dis)credited with an 0-1 for a reached-on-error.

Seems more fair to have that also be an ‘unofficial” at-bat.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

I would be comfortable eliminating errors altogether. The scoring is so haphazard, and the scoring decisions are now generally tilted in the batter’s favor; you can hardly be charged with an error unless the ball is hit right at you, without too much pace, unless of course a home-team pitcher has an ERA among the league leaders.

Errors are just noise now in the big statistical picture. Let them swim in the regular pool along with bloop hits and hard-hit outs.

Voomo Zanzibar

11 years ago

Reply to John Autin

Here’s an article into today’s NYT written by a former official scorer:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/08/sports/baseball/a-baseball-official-scorers-call-isnt-always-last-word.html?_r=1&ref=sports

There’s even a quote from the baseball coach of my alma mater (also attended by Steve Balboni and Brian Sabean).

Voomo Zanzibar

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

Oh, and JA, just to get your thread to 100 comments, and because there’s no recap for the 7/7 games, I’ll mention that the Yankees finally won a game without hitting a home run.

In a game where they scored 10
At Fenway

Though Teix’s go ahead triple flew about 415 on the fly.

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

Actually the 2nd homerless win by the Yanks, but I won’t look a gift comment in the mouth!

Since the thread reached 100, everyone who commented gets the same valuable prize I got when the Camden RiverSharks won their game last Sunday:

One dollar off a hoagie at any Wawa store! (Full-size only.)

(I’ll mail the coupons out just as fast as I can photocopy them.)

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

Do you ship to Great Britain?

Author

John Autin

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

@103 RJ — Only if you give me a different (and British) term for a hoagie / hero / sub / grinder / po-boy / torpedo / wedge / muffaletta / whatnot.

tag

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

John, that term is “belegtes Brot” in German and I’ll be expecting my hoagie delivered fresh and appropriately ontime in Switzerland.

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

@104 JA – Why of course, we call them stuffed American crumpets round these parts.

Nash Bruce

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

wow John! Probably (hopefully?) no one, including you will see this comment (as I do not wish to be a ‘thread extender’ or whatever) but I live on a rock in the middle of the largest ocean on the planet Earth…..but I did grow up in Jersey, so hell yeah, hook me up with that Wawa hoagie!……

Timothy Pea

11 years ago

Reply to Voomo Zanzibar

If Florida they’re called Cubans!

Jason Z

11 years ago

Getting back to Reggie, I would love to know his opinion about Don Mattingly. If he doesn’t support Kirby Puckett he can’t support Mattingly. According to B-ref similarity scores, Puckett is number four to Mattingly, and Mattingly is number one to Puckett. Both had their careers end prematurely. The difference is that Puckett played at a high level throughout, before his vision suffered and he had to retire. Mattingly was on a first ballot HOF pace through 1989, and then the back injury robbed him of his power. He lingered on through 1995 but was never the same. I know… Read more »

MikeD

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

Do you really want to know Reggie’s opinion on Mattingly? If you do, I’m guessing it’s more for humor. : -) I wouldn’t expect consistency of thought from Jackson, although my guess is he would vote no on Mattingly. In fact, I’d be shocked if he thought otherwise. The few comments I’ve seen from Reggie about Mattingly haven’t been overwhelmingly warm. He was upset one Old Timers’ Day when Mattingly was introduced after Reggie, and of course to great and welcoming applause that was dramatically greater than Reggie’s welcome. Reggie was not happy. He wanted to know why the Yankees… Read more »

Lawrence Azrin

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

Even though Mattingly and Puckett show up very high on each other’s Similar Batters list, this _does not_ make them directly comparable in their HOF qualifications. Puckett was mostly a CFer, with some RF (276 G), while Mattingly was a career first baseman (80 games elsewhere). The offensive HOF standards for a career first baseman, even a great-fielding one such as Mattingly, are considerably higher than for a career CFer. That’s why Puckett is over the HOF line, while Mattingly is under it. It’s not fair that Mattingly’s back woes derailed his HOF chances, but you could say that about… Read more »

Jason Z

11 years ago

I guess since the Yankees have banned Reggie, I won’t be getting that Mattingly opinion.

bstar

11 years ago

Reply to Jason Z

I’d like to think I never wish for bad things to happen to anyone, but I do feel the urge to chuckle a little at this. Apparently the Straw that Stirred the Drink stirred a little too viguorously this time.