Circle of Greats 1977 Balloting

This post is for voting and discussion in the 136th round of balloting for the Circle of Greats (COG).  This round of balloting adds to the list of candidates eligible to receive your votes those players born in 1977. Rules and lists are after the jump.

The new group of 1977-born players, in order to join the eligible list, must, as usual, have played at least 10 seasons in the major leagues or generated at least 20 Wins Above Replacement (“WAR”, as calculated by baseball-reference.com, and for this purpose meaning 20 total WAR for everyday players and 20 pitching WAR for pitchers). This group of 1977-born candidates joins the eligible holdovers from previous rounds to comprise the full list of players eligible to appear on your ballots.

In addition to voting for COG election among players on the main ballot, there will be also be voting for elevation to the main ballot among players on the secondary ballot. For the main ballot election, voters must select three and only three eligible players, with the one player appearing on the most ballots cast in the round inducted into the Circle of Greats. For the secondary ballot election, voters may select up to three eligible players, with the one player appearing on the most ballots cast elevated to the main ballot for the next COG election round. In the case of ties, a runoff election round will be held for COG election, while a tie-breaking process will be followed to determine the secondary ballot winner.

Players who fail to win either ballot but appear on half or more of the ballots that are cast win four added future rounds of ballot eligibility. Players who appear on 25% or more of the ballots cast, but less than 50%, earn two added future rounds of ballot eligibility. One additional round of eligibility is earned by any player who appears on at least 10% of the ballots cast or, for the main ballot only, any player finishing in the top 9 (including ties) in ballot appearances. Holdover candidates on the main ballot who exhaust their eligibility will drop to the secondary ballot for the next COG election round, as will first time main ballot candidates who attract one or more votes but do not earn additional main ballot eligibility. Secondary ballot candidates who exhaust their eligibility will drop from that ballot, but will become eligible for possible reinstatement in a future Redemption round election.

All voting for this round closes at 11:59 PM EST Sunday, February 6th, while changes to previously cast ballots are allowed until 11:59 PM EST Friday, February 4th.

If you’d like to follow the vote tally, and/or check to make sure I’ve recorded your vote correctly, you can see my ballot-counting spreadsheet for this round here: COG 1977 Vote Tally. I’ll be updating the spreadsheet periodically with the latest votes. Initially, there is a row in the spreadsheet for every voter who has cast a ballot in any of the past rounds, but new voters are entirely welcome — new voters will be added to the spreadsheet as their ballots are submitted. Also in the spreadsheet is a column for each of the holdover candidates; additional player columns from the new born-in-1977 group will be added to the spreadsheet as votes are cast for them.

Choose your three players, for both the main and secondary ballots, from the lists below of eligible players. The current holdovers are listed in order of the number of future rounds (including this one) through which they are assured eligibility, and alphabetically when the future eligibility number is the same. The 1977 birth-year players are listed below in order of the number of seasons each played in the majors, and alphabetically among players with the same number of seasons played.

Holdovers:

MAIN BALLOT ELIGIBILITY SECONDARY BALLOT ELIGIBILITY
Bill Dahlen 9 rounds Todd Helton 12 rounds
Dick Allen 8 rounds Willie Randolph 12 rounds
Luis Tiant 6 rounds Minnie Minoso 6 rounds
Bobby Wallace 3 rounds Bobby Abreu 4 rounds
Ted Lyons 2 rounds Ken Boyer 4 rounds
Graig Nettles 2 rounds Billy Williams 3 rounds
Scott Rolen 2 rounds Monte Irvin 2 rounds
Ted Simmons 2 rounds Reggie Smith 2 rounds
Don Sutton 2 rounds Lance Berkman this round ONLY
Richie Ashburn this round ONLY    
Stan Coveleski this round ONLY    
Andre Dawson this round ONLY    
Don Drysdale this round ONLY    
Vladimir Guerrero this round ONLY    
David Ortiz this round ONLY    
Rick Reuschel this round ONLY    
Gary Sheffield this round ONLY    

Everyday Players (born in 1977, ten or more seasons played in the major leagues or at least 20 WAR):
Carlos Beltran
Alex Gonzalez
Eric Chavez
Andruw Jones
Marlon Byrd
David Ross
Nick Punto
Willie Bloomquist
Rafael Furcal
Lyle Overbay
Juan Pierre
Brian Roberts
Jack Wilson
Mark Ellis
Eric Hinske
Brandon Inge
Travis Hafner
Orlando Hudson
Wil Nieves
Adam Everett
D’Angelo Jimenez
Craig Monroe
Freddy Sanchez
Jason Smith
Marcus Thames

Pitchers (born in 1977, ten or more seasons played in the major leagues or at least 20 WAR):
A.J. Burnett
Ryan Dempster
Fernando Rodney
Bronson Arroyo
Vicente Padilla
Joaquin Benoit
Roy Halladay
Javier Lopez
Dennys Reyes
Kerry Wood
Bruce Chen
Jason Frasor
Roy Oswalt
Ryan Vogelsong
Joe Beimel
Heath Bell
Will Ohman
J.J. Putz
Kip Wells
Jake Westbrook
Danys Báez
Grant Balfour

As is our custom with first time candidates, here is a factoid and related quiz question on each of the new players on the ballot. Unless specified otherwise, references in the quiz questions are to modern era (since 1901) seasons or games in the AL and NL.

  1. Carlos Beltran recorded 8 seasons with 100+ RBI, but failed to reached 120 RBI in any of them. Which player without a 120+ RBI season has the most 100+ RBI seasons? (Chipper Jones, 9 seasons)
  2. Alex Gonzalez is one of a dozen players with careers including 1500+ games at shortstop and fewer stolen bases than triples. Which player in that group has the highest career totals for both stolen bases and triples? (Joe Cronin)
  3. Eric Chavez played over 1200 games at 3B for the A’s. Who is the only player with more 3B games for the A’s? (Sal Bando, 1446 games at 3B for A’s)
  4. Andruw Jones and his teammate Chipper Jones jointly recorded 7 seasons with both reaching 25 HR and 90 RBI. Which other team had players with identical surnames record those totals in the same season? (1995 Mariners, Edgar and Tino Martinez)
  5. David Ross is the oldest catcher to homer in the World Series, at age 39 in game 7 of the 2016 series, his final major league game. Who is the oldest player to homer as a catcher in his final regular season game? (Todd Zeile, aged 39 in 2004, off of Claudio Vargas, the last home run allowed by an Expos’ pitcher)
  6. Marlon Byrd is one of 83 retired players with 35 or fewer home runs in 500+ games, incl. 350+ in CF, through his age 29 season. Which of those players has more career home runs than Byrd’s total of 159? (Cy Williams, 251 career HR, incl. 34 through his age 29 season)
  7. Nick Punto’s 1163 career games are the fewest of any player with 300+ games at 2B, 3B and SS. Whose record did Punto break? (Frankie Gustine, 1261 games)
  8. Willie Bloomquist played at least 100 games at 2B, 3B, SS, LF, CF and RF. Which other player did the same? (Woodie Held)
  9. Jack Wilson’s six consecutive seasons (2002-07) with 130+ games at SS is tied with Honus Wagner (1905-10) for the most by a Pirate. Which other expansion era player has six seasons for the Pirates with 130+ games at shortstop? (Jay Bell)
  10. Brian Roberts’ three seasons with 50+ doubles are second only to Tris Speaker’s total of 5 such seasons. Which three players share that ranking with Roberts? (Albert Pujols, Stan Musial, Paul Waner)
  11. Lyle Overbay recorded two seasons with 150+ games at 1B, for both the Brewers and Blue Jays. Which player has a pair of such seasons for three franchises? (Eddie Murray, with Orioles, Dodgers and Mets)
  12. Juan Pierre played in 821 consecutive games from 2002 to 2007, including 334 consecutive games in CF to end the streak. Before Pierre’s 2004 season, who was the last player to play every inning of every team game in CF? (Richie Ashburn, 1953)
  13. Rafael Furcal is one of eleven players with 1500+ games at shortstop to post career totals of 300+ doubles, 50+ triples and 100+ home runs. Which of those players, like Furcal, won a league RoY award? (Derek Jeter)
  14. Ty Wigginton is one of sixteen players with 150+ games at 1B, 2B and 3B. Which of those players has more career home runs than Wigginton’s total of 169? (Paul Molitor, 234 career HR)
  15. Eric Hinske played in three consecutive World Series (2007-09) for three different franchises. Which other player did the same? (Don Baylor, 1986-88)
  16. Mark Ellis launched a 3-run home run for the A’s in the 9th inning of game 5 of the 2002 ALDS. Which second baseman hit a grand slam home run in the 9th final inning of a sudden death post-season game? (Howie Kendrick, 2019 NLDS)
  17. Brandon Inge played 300 games at C and 3B. Which other two players did the same? (Joe Torre, B.J. Surhoff)
  18. Wil Nieves went 0 for 32 to begin his time with the Yankees. Which player has the only longer oh-fer to start his Yankee career? (Marv Breuer, 0 for 49, 1939-40, then he reached base in his next 4 PA with two hits and two walks)
  19. Orlando Hudson recorded eight straight seasons (2003-10) with 120 hits, 20 doubles and a .265 BA. Which second baseman has the longest streak of such seasons? (Roberto Alomar, 1988-2002)
  20. Travis Hafner played 88% of his career games as DH, the highest proportion of any player in a 1000+ game career (or in a 100+ game career). Which other DH matched Hafner’s career HR total and, like him, finished his career as a Yankee? (Kendrys Morales)
  21. Aaron Rowand recorded seasons with 125+ games in CF, 20+ HR and a .300 BA for both the White Sox (2004) and Phillies (2007). Who is the only other player with such a season for either of those franchises? (Cy Williams, 1922 and 1924 Phillies)
  22. Adam Everett is one of four players with 600+ games at shortstop for the Astros. Which of those players has more career home runs than the other three combined? (Carlos Correa)
  23. Marcus Thames recorded a pair of seasons with 25+ HR and fewer than 90 hits? Who is the only player with more such seasons? (Mark McGwire, 1995, 2000, 2001)
  24. Freddy Sanchez played 150+ games at 2B for both the Giants and Pirates. Which other player did the same? (Johnny Rawlings)
  25. Jason Smith posted a career .105 BA as a pinch-hitter. Which player has the only lower BA in 75+ career AB as a pinch-hitter? (Tommy Byrne, .080 BA as a pinch-hitter)
  26. Craig Monroe homered in each of his first two World Series games in 2006. Which player has the only longer streak of such games to begin his World Series career? (Barry Bonds, 3 games, 2002 WS)
  27. D’Angelo Jimenez stroked four hits in the 3rd game of his career. Which other Yankee did the same? (Howie Camp, 1917)
  28. A.J. Burnett led the majors with 25 wild pitches in 2011. Which pitcher had a season with more wild pitches while leading his league in W-L%? (Juan Guzman, 1993)
  29. Fernando Rodney led his league with 48 saves at age 37 in 2014. Who is the oldest league saves leader since it became an official statistic in 1969? (Trevor Hoffman, age 38 in 2006)
  30. Ryan Dempster led his league in games finished in 2006, and in his games started in 2014. Which pitcher led his league at least twice in each of those categories? (Wilbur Wood GF: 1968 and 1970, GS: 1972-75; Ed Walsh GF: 1904 and 1912-13, GS: 1907-08 and 1913)
  31. Bronson Arroyo posted a franchise record eight seasons (2006-13) with 30 or more starts for the Reds. Which two pitchers also recorded 30+ starts in each of those seasons and, like Arroyo, hold franchise records for such seasons? (Felix Hernandez, Mark Buehrle)
  32. Vicente Padilla began his post-season career in 2009 with a pair of 7+ IP starts allowing no more than 4 hits and one run in each. Which other Dodger did the same? (Don Sutton, 1974)
  33. Javier Lopez is the only pitcher to record 100+ relief IP for the Giants, Red Sox and Rockies. Which other pitcher recorded 100+ relief IP for the Rockies and for one of the other two franchises? (Matt Herges, Rockies and Giants)
  34. Joaquin Benoit recorded a 200+ ERA+ score in 50+ IP seasons for three different franchises. Who is the only starting pitcher to do this? (Roger Clemens, for Red Sox, Blue Jays and Astros)
  35. Roy Halladay won a Cy Young Award in each league. Who was the first pitcher to do this? (Gaylord Perry, for Indians in 1972 and Padres in 1978, his first season in each of those uniforms)
  36. Kerry Wood, at age 21, started game 3 of the 1998 NLDS with his team facing elimination. Who is the only younger pitcher to start a post-season elimination game? (Fernando Valenzuela, 1981 NLDS and 1981 NLCS)
  37. Dennys Reyes posted consecutive seasons (2008-09) of 75+ games averaging less than two outs per appearance. Who was the first pitcher to do this? (Tom Martin, 2003-04)
  38. Jason Frasor’s 505 games is a Blue Jays franchise record for pitchers. Which pitcher holds the Blue Jay career record for relief IP? (Duane Ward)
  39. Bruce Chen is the career IP leader among Panamanian-born pitchers. Who is the career WAR leader among these pitchers? (Mariano Rivera, 56 WAR)
  40. Roy Oswalt’s .636 W-L% is the Astro franchise record in 100+ decisions. Which pitcher has more wins as an Astro than Oswalt’s total of 143? (Joe Niekro, 144 Astro wins)
  41. Ryan Vogelsong recorded 300+ IP for the Giants and Pirates. Which two contemporaries of Vogelsong did the same (though neither was ever Vogelsong’s teammate)? (Jason Schmidt, Kevin Correia)
  42. J.J. Putz is one of thirteen pitchers to record 35+ saves with 180+ ERA+ in 3 or more seasons. Who was the first pitcher to do this? (Doug Jones in 1988, 1992 and 1997)
  43. Heath Bell pitched in 354 games in 5 years (2007-11) with the Padres. Which pitcher appeared in the most games in a 5-year span playing for one franchise? (Pedro Feliciano, 408 games with 2006-10 Mets)
  44. Jake Westbrook went 6+ IP and took the loss for the Indians as the game 7 starter in the 2007 ALCS. Which other Cleveland starting pitcher recorded 6+ IP in a post-season sudden death game? (Jaret Wright, 1997 WS)
  45. Joe Beimel recorded 180+ IP for the Dodgers and Pirates. Which other expansion era relief pitcher did the same? (Pete Mikkelsen)
  46. Kip Wells twice led his league in losses with fewer than 200 IP. Which other pitcher did the same? (Jose DeLeon, 1985 and 1990)
  47. Will Ohman recorded three seasons with 65+ appearances and BB/9 over 4.5. Who was the first pitcher to do this? (Mitch Williams, 1986-88)
  48. Grant Balfour is one of five pitchers with 200+ games for the Rays and 200+ games for a second franchise. Which of those pitchers recorded the highest career WAR? (Roberto Hernandez, 18.5 WAR)
  49. Danys Báez recorded 26 starts in the 2002 season and no starts the rest of his career, one of 21 expansion era pitchers (including several notables) with a single 25+ start season in a 500+ game career. Which of those pitchers is in the Hall of Fame? (Goose Gossage)
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Jeff Harris
Jeff Harris
4 months ago

Main: Sheffield, Ortiz, Guerrero
Secondary: Smith, Williams, Helton

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

Thanks for putting this together, Doug!

Question #49: I’m guessing Hoyt Wilhelm. Fairly sure I read a while back that for one season in the middle of his career he was used primarily as a starter, which has got to be an outlier among the other pitchers who meet the criteria for your question. Then again, his entire career could be classified as an outlier.

Question #48 (yes, I started looking at the questions from the bottom up): James Sheilds?

And I have no idea whatsoever for #47, so I’ll stop there.

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Wilhelm’s lone season with 25+ starts came in 1959, so not in the expansion era. Looking for someone else.

Shields has 200 games for the Rays, but he doesn’t have 200 games for any other franchise. So, not him.

Hint for #47: the pitcher I’m looking for gave up a famous post-season home run.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Two years off on Wilhelm. Looks like Dr. Doom came up with the answer below. As for my other guess, apparently I didn’t read the question very well. For all the good starters the Rays have had and eventually traded, the answer is more likely a reliever in order to have 200+ appearances for two franchises. Thanks for the hint on #47. Pitchers who gave us famous post-season home runs: I thought first of Dennis Eckersley, Donnie Moore, and Mitch Williams. BB/9 over 4.5 – it has to be Wild Thing, doesn’t it? For #36, Fernando Valenzuela was still 20… Read more »

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Interesting… I’m not picking up on it yet, but someone will figure it out.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 1: I found Chipper Jones with 9 such seasons

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

Good find, Richard. I was surprised to come across three other players (Dave Winfield, Fred McGriff, and Bobby Abreu) who matched Beltran in having eight seasons of 100+ RBI without ever reaching 120. But I didn’t see anyone else with as many as Chipper.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 5: He only had 130 games as a catcher but Todd Zeile was behind the plate in his final game on 10/3/2004 at age 39.024 and hit a HR.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 4: Seattle in 1995 with Tino and Edgar Martinez.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 27: The illustrious Howie Camp whose number 3 game was the highlight of his 5 game ML career.

Doug
Doug
4 months ago

So, a bunch more players got inducted. But, still no Bobby Grich (71 WAR), Willie Randolph (66 WAR) or Luis Tiant (66 WAR). But, they did select Jim Kaat (45 WAR), Tony Oliva (43 WAR) and Gil Hodges (44 WAR). Tough to figure.

Here’s how Kaat stacks up against Tiant (you’ll have to bump up the zoom on your browser).
comment image

Last edited 4 months ago by Doug
Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Not really using any advanced metrics, I think there is a pretty strong argument in Kaat’s favor. I mean, Kaat’s ERA is worse… but not even 5% worse. And that’s with nearly 30% more innings! That’s an enormous leap. And if you look at FIP, it tells you that Kaat was even better than Tiant, in spite of pitching nearly an extra third of a career. Add on the fact that Kaat is considered one of the best ever to play his position defensively, and you can see why someone would come to that conclusion using two of the most… Read more »

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Probably no crazier than Oliva, Hodges, and Minoso getting in over Dick Allen. I imagine a comparison similar to Kaat vs. Tiant would reflect similarly poor optics for the Old Guys’ Committee voters

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question: 12: Not sure of this one but I’ll go with Richie Ashburn in 1953.

Mark
Mark
4 months ago

Resident Pirates fan here…Question 9 has to be Jay Bell, right?

(As always, love the site, All!)

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Mark

Bell is correct. Without the 1994 strike, he would have had 7 consecutive seasons (1990-96) for the Bucs with 130+ games at short.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago

Some low-hanging fruit: 10. Albert Pujols, Paul Waner, and Stan Musial. Well THAT is the poster-child for the “let’s make a group” fallacy in action! 11. If I’m understanding the question correctly, I think it’s Eddie Murray, who played 150+ twice for the Orioles (duh), Dodgers, and Mets. 23. Mark McGwire – 1995, 2000, and his incredible 2001, which featured 56 walks, 29 HR, 4 doubles, and only 23 singles. One of the oddest, most lopsided seasons in history. (Also, I’m not sure how many other players have more hits in a season in which H=BB, which just adds to… Read more »

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

All correct, except #43. Re: #11, I guessed that John Olerud would have done it with the Blue Jays, Mets and Mariners, but he had no such seasons for Toronto, who spelled him at DH and sat him down against certain left-handers (the year before Joe Carter’s walk-off HR to clinch the ’93 WS, it was Carter who took the toss at first base for the final out in the ’92 WS clincher, though manager Cito Gaston probably should have put in Olerud, who was a fine defender even then, for that final inning protecting a 2 run lead). Regarding… Read more »

Last edited 4 months ago by Doug
Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago

I’m open to discussion changing my mind. But here’s my first attempt at my ballots. Primary Roy Halladay – Best pitcher on the ballot, best overall player. I always loved Halladay as a pitcher, going back to feeling bad for him as a Blue Jay pitching against powerhouse Yanks and Sawx (it seemed like) every day. He also died on my 31st birthday. Scott Rolen – Rolen is the best position player on the ballot. He, Jones, and Beltran are all all-time great defenders with plus bats. I would imagine that they’d all get in… eventually. But I think Rolen… Read more »

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago
Reply to  Doug

I have him quite low. A good peak helps (it’s basically a peak-adjusted WAR, with some other minor adjustments thrown in). But the only players he comes out ahead of are Lyons (weak peak and FIP hates him) and Ortiz (average peak and just low WAR). He’s actually ahead of Simmons by raw score, too, but the catcher bonus pushes Simmons ahead. The three I voted for (plus Jones) are the only guys I have over 70 (and this is basically scaled to career WAR). Then I have 14 guys (beginning with Dick Allen and ending with Guerrero) in a… Read more »

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Your approach reminds me of something Bill James wrote in one of his Abstracts, when explaining whom he thought should be in the HoF. In the main, he felt Hall-worthy players should have been commonly recognized at some point in their career as the best player in the game at their position (or maybe it was “among the best”, can’t recall exactly). Ergo, he was rewarding a high peak, as you are doing. The FanGraphs WAR for pitchers is more of a DIPS type of metric, isn’t it, with a big focus on strikeouts, walks and home runs that are… Read more »

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

I may choose to write a DIPS-related main post sometime here, because perhaps there could be some interesting discussion on this matter. But I’m just going to let it lie for now. But I’d like to talk a bit about the other point you discussed, which has to do with peak performance in judging a career. Regarding peak performance, I think most people do consider it on some level. MVP awards, pennants, All-Star appearances… those things matter to everyone. But for me, it comes down to: what’s the point? I mean the whole point – of player analysis, yes, but… Read more »

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Interesting take on the importance of peak value. Thanks.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Doug: The Circle of Greats 1970 Balloting was posted on 1/10/2015. There was a comment by erstwhile reader mosc. He presented a method of calculating peak values of WAR. It may be useful for analyzing the importance of peak value so you may want to revisit it.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

Thanks for the tip, Richard.

Voomo
Voomo
4 months ago

I’ll vote for the new guys. I think these three deserve to get on the ballot:

Carlos Beltran
Andruw Jones
Roy Halladay

Voomo
Voomo
4 months ago

Secondary

Willie Randolph
Minnie Minoso
Billy Williams

JEV
JEV
4 months ago

Primary: Sheffield, Simmons, Beltran
Secondary: Smith, Abreu, Irvin

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago

A couple more trivia answers: 31. Justin Verlander (DET) and Felix Hernandez (SEA), I believe. Verlander’s streak of 30+ starts actually lasted another year (2014), while Hernandez’s lasted two more (2015). 34. Roger Clemens, for BOS, TOR, and HOU. Didn’t manage it for the Yankees. My first guess was actually Pedro, knowing he’d done it for two franchises, but I was a bit surprised he hadn’t had such a season with the Mets. 42. Mariano Rivera? That seems too easy, but I think it’s right. 1997-1999. If there’s someone earlier, I couldn’t find it. 15. This is not the correct… Read more »

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

All correct, except #31, which is only half right, as Verlander does not have the Tiger record for 30+ start seasons, a mark held by Mickey Lolich.

Last edited 4 months ago by Doug
Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Could it be Matt Cain instead?

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Not Cain. Mathewson, Marichal and Hubbell all have more 30+ start seasons for the Giants.

Mike L
Mike L
4 months ago

Glad to see this back.

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago

15) Don Baylor BOS 1986 MINN 1987 OAK 1988

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
4 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

Oh, good find! May I ask what your method was for finding this?! Did you just remember or read it on the back of a baseball card or something? Or did you have a way to look it up?

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Just remembered some typical sports “talk” about “leadership” and Don Baylor. Also, somewhat later on, Dave Winfield (1991 MINN and 1992 TOR) tooting his own horn about leadership. These guys love to be heroes….let’s see them make a 70-win team a 90-win team upon being traded to a “90-game-loser”…..but, obviously, I digress 🙁
So, yeah, short story longer, I remembered

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

mea culpa….Winfield was not on the 1991 Twins. He just was excited about his “leadership” in some puff-piece interview during the ’92 WS with TOR. Obviously, they won it all (again) w/o him in 1993

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

While Winfield wasn’t with the 1991 Twins, Jack Morris was and then joined the Blue Jays in 1992.

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Yes, Molitor almost won an MVP award in 1993 replacing Winfield at DH for Toronto. Winfield moved on to his hometown Twins in 1993

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

The answer can be found by using baseball-reference’s Stathead +manual searching.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 24: Johnny Rawlings

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

Rawlings’ career spanned the end of the dead ball era and the beginning of the live ball era. A decent glove man, he was consistently inept offensively in both periods: dead ball – .563 OPS=72 OPS+; live ball – .653 OPS=72 OPS+.

Last edited 3 months ago by Doug
Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

#22 – Carlos Correa

Paul E
Paul E
4 months ago

#14) Paul Molitor ?

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

You’ve got it, Paul.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 18: Marv Breuer was 0 for55.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

#46 – Jose DeLeon in 1985 and 1990.

Oh so close was Rodrigo Lopez, who led the AL in losses in 2006 (189 innings) and the NL in 2010 (exactly 200 innings).

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

#44 – Hopefully I’m not interpreting the question wrong. I found two:

Orel Hershiser: 7 innings in Game 4 of the 1997 ALDS
Jaret Wright: 6-1/3 innings in Game 7 of the 1997 WS

Doug
Doug
4 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

By sudden-death, I meant it was an elimination game for both teams. So, Wright is the one I was looking for.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

#28 – Juan Guzman in 1993 (26 wild pitches; .824 winning percentage).

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 8: Woodie Held

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 33: Matt Herges for the Rockies and the Giants.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
4 months ago

Question 43: I came up with Pedro Feliciano, 408 games with the Mets from 2006-2010.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
4 months ago

#20 – Kendrys Morales

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Morales and George Wright are the only players with 3 or more hits in the first and last games of a career longer than one game. Morales gets the tie-breaker with a Run and an RBI in each game (Wright had both in his debut, neither in his finale).

Another note on Wright: his -3.7 WAR in 1985 is the third lowest season mark since 1901, and the lowest WAR per PA in any 300+ PA season (and lowest by a fair margin at -0.94 WAR per 100 PA, compared to -0.81 for second place Jerry Royster in 1977).

Last edited 3 months ago by Doug
CursedClevelander
CursedClevelander
3 months ago

I think this is our most interesting new ballot in a while. People who usually give players a PED discount or write them off entirely, what are your thoughts on Beltran’s role in the 2017 Astros sign stealing scandal?

For trivia, #3, is it Sal Bando?

Mike L
Mike L
3 months ago

I’m anti-PEDS period. In the “real’ world I thought Ortiz was given a pass because people liked him, or were afraid to dislike him in public. Either open the gates or not. Beltran’s cheating role (particularly because he was a-still active player) would play heavily in my decision. Cheating matters.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago

CC,

I’m genuinely shocked to see Beltran (for the moment, anyway) polling ahead of Roy Halladay. There’s the Mike L point below, and there’s the tragic early death, the dominance… color me surprised.

CursedClevelander
CursedClevelander
3 months ago

41. One of these should definitely be Jason Schmidt.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago

Is the other pitcher for #41 Kevin Correia?

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 37: I came up with 2 pitchers, Mike Myers and Bob Patterson both in 1996-1997.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

Of those four seasons, only Myers’ 1997 qualifies. So, neither of those players.

Remember, it’s a max of 2/3 of an inning per appearance.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

I’ll try again. Was it Tom Martin in 2003-2004?

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 7: Frank Gustine

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

Gustine, born in 1920, remained a regular in the Pirate lineup throughout the war on account of a 4-F classification. Thus, he was able to compile 300+ games at 2B, 3B and SS, all before turning 30. Gustine played third briefly in his debut season at age 19, then became the Bucs’ regular second baseman in ’40, ’41 and ’42. The Pirates got four players in the Arky Vaughan trade, including Pete Coscarart whom they tried in Vaughan’s shortstop spot for one season, before moving Gustine there. Then, when Bob Elliott was dealt to Boston, Gustine was moved again, to… Read more »

Last edited 3 months ago by Doug
Andy
Andy
3 months ago

Primary: Beltran, Halladay, Rolen

Secondary: Boyer, Helton, Abreu

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 32: Don Sutton

Paul E
Paul E
3 months ago

17) Joe Torre and….?

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

B.J. Surhoff is the other for #17.

Paul E
Paul E
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

thanks

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago

#19 – Roberto Alomar has the longest streak I can find among second basemen with 120 hits, 20 doubles and a .265 BA: 15 years in row (1988-2002). He reached 120 hits exactly in the strike-shortened 1994 season.

Tom
Tom
3 months ago

#13 Derek Jeter. I initially thought Nomar. But Nomar only played 1434 games total. In 14 years, he had 6 seasons of less than 81 games.

Paul E
Paul E
3 months ago

30) Ed Walsh

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 21: Cy Williams had 2 such seasons for the Phillies, 1922 and 1924

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago

Doug, I really thought Lenny Dykstra was going to be the answer for #21. Only he missed it by one HR.

The real answer appears to be Cy Williams for the Phillies in 1924, not his more famous ’23 in which he entered the conversation with Hornsby to become the “NL’s Babe Ruth” by hitting 41 HR. However, that was the only season from 1920-26 that Williams failed to hit .300. So his 24-HR effort from ’24 is the correct answer.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Doug: Concerning question 16 the only 2B that I could find to hit a GS in a sudden-death post-season game was Howie Kendrick in game 5 of the 2019 NLDS but it occurred in the 10th inning.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

Right you are, Richard. Kendrick is who I was looking for. My intended meaning was “9th or later” innings, but that’s not what I wrote. Sorry about that.

bells
bells
3 months ago

Is the second pitcher in #31 Buehrle? He had 11 such seasons for the Sox and fits the other criteria.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  bells

Buehrle is correct.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago

#30 – Wilbur Wood led the AL twice in GF (1968, 1970), then in GS four times (1972-5).

Paul E
Paul E
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Tuna,
I found Ed Walsh as well. Another CWS…perhaps there are more?

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago
Reply to  Paul E

That was a great find, Paul, especially as Walsh once led in both categories the same season (1912)!

I always try to see if someone else has answered a question before I post, but I’m sorry I still missed your answer above to #30. Thanks reposting it here. Maybe we will find another.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Wood was the one I was looking for. But, nice find on Walsh.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago

#29 – Trevor Hoffman led the league in saves in his age-38 season (2006), but I don’t know if he’s the oldest player to do so.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

I believe he is.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Interestingly, there are numerous examples of pitchers older than Hoffman leading in saves before it became an official stat in 1969. Al Worthington was saves leader at age 39 in 1968, as were Al Brazle and Joe Berry, at the same age, in 1953 and 1944, respectively. Jim Turner turned the trick at age 41 in 1945, but the real prize belongs to Jack Quinn, saves leader in 1931-32 at age 47-48.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Main: Sheffield, Ortiz, Guerrero

Secondary: Minoso, Willikams, Berkman

Trivia fact about Billy Williams: He holds the record for the most games played in a 5 year period, 814 games from 1965-1969.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 25: Despite some contradictions on BR Stathead the best answer I came up with is pitcher Tommy Byrne with 6 H in 75 AB for a .080 BA. Oddly enough he batted .258 while in the game as a pitcher. I saw him get 1 of his 6 H as a PH, a game-winning GS versus the Yankees on 5/16/1953.

Voomo
Voomo
3 months ago

So, are we doing 7 votes this year?

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago
Reply to  Voomo

Should just be one; the BBWAA sets our pace. The Veterans process had no bearing on COG membership.

Voomo
Voomo
3 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Well, seven would be more fun.

Perhaps we can gently acknowledge that the end of civilization is upon us and we may not have many more years to do this

Paul E
Paul E
3 months ago
Reply to  Voomo

“Perhaps we can gently acknowledge that the end of civilization is upon us and we may not have many more years to do this”

Don’t worry, it’s just a lockout…millionaires versus billionaires type stuff. In the interest of capitalism, they’ll be back to work soon enough 🙂

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago

Question 2: Joe Cronin

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago

#38 is Duane Ward, 649.2 relief innings for the Jays.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago

I finally figured out #26!!! I had been thinking that it was probably a young player in his first World Series. But then for the first time today, I thought, “What if it was someone old?” And then I got it: Barry Bonds homered in the first three games of the 2002 World Series! One more thing, Doug: in one of my earlier comments, I suggested that Mariano Rivera was the answer for #42 (the JJ Putz question). In a comment below it, you said I was right… but then it doesn’t appear on the list. So let me know!… Read more »

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

First thanks for the compliment. For #6 I came up with Cy Williams who had 251 lifetime HR. For #42 I got Doug Jones.in 1988, 1992 and 1997.

Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

I don’t think anyone has answered #45 yet.

Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

It’s Rick Rhoden.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

It’s not Rhoden. Or Jerry Reuss. Looking for a relief pitcher. Hint is he allowed a famous post-season home run.

Last edited 3 months ago by Doug
Scary Tuna
Scary Tuna
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

This one took a while to find: Pete Mikkelson, who as a rookie with the Yankees yielded Tim McCarver’s three-run homer in the top of the 10th inning of Game 5 in the 1964 World Series.

After losing in seven games to the Cardinals, the Yankees – who had made the World Series five consecutive seasons and 14 out of 16 – wouldn’t return to the playoffs for 13 years. Mikkelsen went on to pitch for the Pirates, Cubs, Cardinals, and Dodgers in a nine-year career, but his teams never reached the post-season again.

Dr. Doom
Dr. Doom
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

Wow, I never would’ve found that! Good work, Tuna! (That means we got ’em all, right?)

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Scary Tuna

McCarver picked up his battery mate Bob Gibson, who was one out away from a four hit shutout win when Tom Tresh tied the game with a 2-run blast. Gibson stayed in the game to close out the 10th, and the Cardinals went back home up 3-2 in the series.

Mikkelsen, a New York City native, was traded by the Yankees to the Pirates for Bob Friend who, at the time of the trade, had almost 3500 innings on his 35 year-old arm. Friend would last just one more season, split between the Yankees and Mets.

Last edited 3 months ago by Doug
Richard Chester
Richard Chester
3 months ago
Reply to  Doug

Doug: Early in the game I posted all the questions into a Word document.At the time question 45 did not show the word “relief”.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago

You’re right. I spotted that omission and corrected it.

Doug
Doug
3 months ago
Reply to  Dr. Doom

Sorry Doom. I thought you were guessing Rivera for the Bruce Chen question, which I’ve noted. Rivera is not the answer to the J.J. Putz question.